MSE News: Hotpoint tumble dryer help: 3 extra tricks to get you a refund

Zandoni

unholyangel wrote: »

As I've been saying repeatedly through this, all appliances have a risk of fire. Even with this fault being present the last 11 years, tumble driers are still not the biggest risk in your home. In fact, in a 3 year period from 2011 to 2014, there were 12000 fires caused by appliances.

I don't think anyone has at any point said hotpoint tumble driers don't pose a risk - just that they're not the instant death trap people on here are making them out to be.

In other words, the perceived risk of these machines is much higher than the actual risk.

We have all said all the through this that all electrical appliances carry a risk of fire.

But Hotpoint have admitted that they have been making products that carry a greater risk and this should not be trivialised.

Zandoni

AJXX wrote: »

Just on this particular point - I suggest you have a read through the previous thread on the subject.

Not sure on the exact numbers but I'd say there have been more people reporting burning smells or smoke than those reporting the machine "spontaneously combusted" - in fact I don't even think we've had anyone report the machine spontaneously combust at all? I'm not sure what you've been reading but it doesn't reflect the majority of posts I've seen on here.

Again, I'm not looking to start an all out war and I'm well aware that the machines are dangerous regardless; but please can we at least have grounded descriptions and facts for other people reading the thread instead of it becoming a cesspit of scaremongering.

I'd suggest you have a little Google, you'll find plenty that burnt quickly.

unholyangel

Zandoni wrote: »

We have all said all the through this that all electrical appliances carry a risk of fire.

But Hotpoint have admitted that they have been making products that carry a greater risk and this should not be trivialised.

A greater risk than what? If the machine had the fix applied? Yes. A greater risk than a washing machine, dishwasher or deep fat fryer? No.

But you personally kept posting about how hotpoint knowingly sold these dangerous machines for 11 years (your words, not mine) - which proves my point exactly. By your logic we should be screaming blue murder at any washing machine manufacturer given that even with no design flaws like the tumble driers in question, their machines pose more of a risk so they are knowingly selling dangerous machines. And they've obviously been knowingly selling them for decades! :eek:

Zandoni

unholyangel wrote: »

A greater risk than what? If the machine had the fix applied? Yes. A greater risk than a washing machine, dishwasher or deep fat fryer? No.

But you personally kept posting about how hotpoint knowingly sold these dangerous machines for 11 years (your words, not mine) - which proves my point exactly. By your logic we should be screaming blue murder at any washing machine manufacturer given that even with no design flaws like the tumble driers in question, their machines pose more of a risk so they are knowingly selling dangerous machines. And they've obviously been knowingly selling them for decades! :eek:

A greater risk than one that hasn't been fixed. I can't tell you if they carry a greater risk than other appliances, this thread is about Hotpoint tumble driers.

Please supply a link to where I said that Hotpoint knowingly sold these dodgy machines for 11 years.

wealdroam

Zandoni wrote: »

Please supply a link to where I said that Hotpoint knowingly sold these dodgy machines for 11 years.

This post comes close.

Zandoni

wealdroam wrote: »

This post comes close.

But no cigar.

unholyangel

Zandoni wrote: »

A greater risk than one that hasn't been fixed. I can't tell you if they carry a greater risk than other appliances, this thread is about Hotpoint tumble driers.

Please supply a link to where I said that Hotpoint knowingly sold these dodgy machines for 11 years.

Are you now saying that they didn't know about this particular issue? That what you were claiming was fact in the other thread now isn't even your own opinion?

Because on the other thread, you were refusing to consider it as a possibility and stated it was a fact they knew about this because (according to you) any time there was a fire, there would be an investigation into the cause so it was inconceivable to you that they wouldn't know.

However powerful rogue said this:

But I thought according to you it was a "fact" that they knew the machines they were producing for the last 11 years were faulty.

Supply me with the evidence of this "fact" and i'll agree with you 100%.

And this was your response to him:

You supply me with evidence that they didn't know and I'll agree with you 100%

Then AJXX said this:

As I said earlier, there is a big difference between them knowing about a safety issue and carelessly doing nothing about it (which is what I think you where trying to imply earlier) or them receiving reports about fires from machines in general.

So which is it,

Reports about fires or are you going the whole hog and simply saying Hotpoint both knew there was a design flaw and sold dodgy machines for 11 years?

To which you replied this:

I'll go nearly the whole hog and say they knew for a very large percentage of those 11 years and continued to produce them.

Or even better, wealdroam saying this :

Others have asked before, but I'll try one more time:

Please can you provide some sort of proof, evidence, writing, etc, that what you are saying - that Hotpoint 'have been churning out these faulty products for 11 years' - has any truth.

If you can't do that then I, and I am sure others, can only assume you are making it up.

Oh, and please don't come back and say "you prove otherwise and I'll agree with you", as that brings your whole campaign into disrepute.

To which you replied with this:

I suppose the simple answer is that Hotpoint have admitted it themselves by saying that the affected machines go back 11 years.

Zandoni

unholyangel wrote: »

Are you now saying that they didn't know about this particular issue? That what you were claiming was fact in the other thread now isn't even your own opinion?

Because on the other thread, you were refusing to consider it as a possibility and stated it was a fact they knew about this because (according to you) any time there was a fire, there would be an investigation into the cause so it was inconceivable to you that they wouldn't know.

However powerful rogue said this:


And this was your response to him:


Then AJXX said this:


To which you replied this:


Or even better, wealdroam saying this :


To which you replied with this:

I said that Hotpoint produced faulty machines for 11 years which they have admitted to, I also said that they knew for a large percentage of those years.

You accused me of saying they knowingly sold them for 11 years.

None of your quotes back up your accusations so please apologise.

unholyangel

Zandoni wrote: »

I said that Hotpoint produced faulty machines for 11 years which they have admitted to, I also said that they knew for a large percentage of those years.

You accused me of saying they knowingly sold them for 11 years.

None of your quotes back up your accusations so please apologise.

Where do I start with this one.....

What I said was:

But you personally kept posting about how hotpoint knowingly sold these dangerous machines for 11 years

Does the 11 years relate to how long they knew or how long they were selling the machines?

Its pretty much the same distinction AJXX asked you to make (that is quoted in my above post) - whether you were referring to them knowing of reports that their machines had caught fire or them knowing of this particular safety issue and still selling machines and you chose the latter!

You've previously referred to the machines as "the fire hazard in consumers homes" - not an increased fire hazard, not one of many fire hazards but THE fire hazard.

Your argument here is what? You didn't claim they knew the entire 11 years, just a "very large percentage of those 11 years"?

Although I still can't see your logic. You're admitting all appliances carry a fire risk yet were stating it was a fact hotpoint knew about the issue and kept selling the machines because (according to you) any time their machines were involved in a fire, they would have been notified. Yet if all appliances carry a fire risk and you know this, why would it then be proof they knew of a design fault? You can't have it both ways!

Zandoni

unholyangel wrote: »

Your argument here is what? You didn't claim they knew the entire 11 years, just a "very large percentage of those 11 years"?

Although I still can't see your logic.

Well my logic is simple, you accused me of saying something I didn't.