A Diary of Reinventing Ourselves

m4rc

Don't worry about not responding, I wrote too much anyway!

You asked about working through lists and finding time to manage this stuff. I spent 20 years of my life living by lists, and the best advice I got was from a Buddhist friend who saw me wih my list (I think at that time it had about 300 tasks in many different sections and sub sections, I used to use fancy apps to manage it) and said 'what happens to those tasks when you are dead? Errr uhhhmmmmm well I guess they don't get done. 'And will that matter?' I had to say no it probably wouldn't. He said I needed to do things that were essential for the health welfare and happiness of me and my family and everything else probably didn't need doing. Damn was he right.

I spent a few days starting to delete tasks, some had been on there for 5 or more years and I was clearly never going to do them, slowly he list shrank, but it was still huge. Then one morning feeling a bit fed up wih stuff I deleted the app. I knew I had backups that would find all the info again so it was a weak gesture.

It played on my mind all day, what was I going to do without my lists? Then for some reason I decided to download the app again, once installed I deleted the backups and then deleted the app. I felt really odd, then really good. I haven't made a list since, and I don't think I will. Actually, that's not true, I make shopping lists, as I forget what I want otherwise, and as its a 40 mile round trip to the supermarket it's not good to forget the thing I went out for!

I have also found I'm better at remembering stuff (not shopping obviously!), as I was relying on an app to do it all I got lazy. You know when people say how they don't remember phone numbers as they are all in their phones but years ago we all remembered loads of numbers, could reel off friends and families numbers without blinking. It's kind of like that, my mind has to remember stuff, but that's not an excuse to have lists in my head. Instead if I need to do something I do it there and then, as soon as I can, or I probably actually don't need to do it. I certainly don't need to write it down, if the smoke alarm battery needs changing it reminds me if I forget!

I'm going to get grief for this, but I wouldn't worry about YNAB. People who use it love it and some think everyone else should use it. It's not for everyone. I found it very frustrating and I didn't want to live by life to someone's defined format. Use it if you want, but from what I've read over the last 14 pages you really don't want to, you've made that very clear. So cross it off, don't use debt busting doesn't need putting into slots, just put aside a little time to make a call when you need to, and keep track of stuff. Do it when you WANT to do it, it is important at the moment as you are trying to make changes, but it must not take over your life or become an issue or you won't do it. Once you've made the savings it's very easy to track stuff. You must get I'm outside the habit now of tracking everything you spend, ideally don't spend on any credit cards, each use one debit card, and that does the tracking for you. You can make a list each day of what you've spent, most days it will be minimal like 'sainsburys £24' 'petrol £30'. That's not hard to do. It will highlight small frivolous purchases of you are making them and help you to stop. If you need to take some cash out, note how much you took, decide when you can take more so how long it must last, and that's it. In theory that cash you can spend as you want, it's your pocket money. Not £300 a week each, £20, something realistic. We all need some money for bits and pieces. If you make this too torturous you won't get the support of your OH, he needs a little, he earns well.

What's the Amazon family thing you are looking for subscriptions on? Just curious!


FT - your little list from 12:40 this morning, read it again. What do you notice, what jumps out?

To me, it's a very negative list. Wade through this, exclamation marks not used in a happy positive way, things look complex....

So why do it? You know these things need doing, you won't forget. Don't write them down, pick one, any one, your favourite or least favourite, and do it. Doesn't matter when, just do it. I don't think you need a reminder to clean, and you certainly don't need a reminder to look after the kids - I think at was telling yourself (not us) that you don't have e time for the stuff above it and can't possibly fit it all in as you have to look after 4 kids!

You are right, so just concentrate on them. Actually the only important thing on that list is he kids.

Setup new business is not a thing to do, or a task. It's a goal. If you want a list of goals, then write one, make it huge, put it on the wall. Do it like a big picture, draw stuff on it, but don't keep it to yourself, let the kids put their goals on there. Why not go further, why not dream? Use the picture for your dreams. Sure, one of the kids may want to learn to fly or or own a unicorn or be a film star, but that's great, we can all dream. What it does is show you that you all can think bigger than cleaning the loo and reading bank statements.

You want to run a successful business, so that goes on. You want to own your home - what's it going to look like? Where will you all live? Any dream holidays?

Then a little reality, most of it will be possible, but it will take effort and money. And in some cases the laws of physics will need to be changed, that's a little tricky so we won't worry about that for now!

Being debt free isn't a dream, or at least it shouldn't be, it's a goal. But it's never a task for a list. Owning a house isn't a task. Paying a bill is a task. Changing suppliers is a task. Buying a cheaper car is a task. Researching mortgages is a task. Paying in the deposit for your new home is a task. Picking up the keys is a task.

Writing a big list of things that includes goals, dreams, tedious chores and routine life stuff isn't good, it's a bad list, you can't tick those things off, certainly not for a while, how can you tick off 'look after four children' - is that completed when they have all left home? Married? When one leaves home does it become 3 and you forget about the other?

I KNOW that's not what you meant, but you put it on you list, I didn't. It's a bit like setting yourself an impossible task, tomorrow I'm going to win the lottery. Well you know what, you may as well not get up as thats not happening.

Becoming debt free is bigger than writing a list of tasks, and it's one goal amongst many in your life. It's ok if your husbands goals are different, there is always compromise, and it will also help you both to see what the other wants, how you think, and that most stuff is possible but you need to make small changes today.

Some will say lists are great. Sure, for doing a safety inspection, an audit, keeping a register of kids in a class. But for life I think lists limit our potential and convince us we will never ever achieve our goals, after all the list will never be complete.

getmore4less

Another that thinks that time spent on YNAB may not benefit you for your finances and family dynamic.

I have been reading the YBAB help thread and from what I can see it is probably not the right tool, people keep coming up with question how do I do this and the "experts" just asy this is the workaround for that key element of budgets.

I much prefer MSMoney it maps onto real life so much better it is very intuative.

once setup
you do a plan(budget) to decide where you want you money to go.
you record all the transactions(does not take long unless you want to micro catagorise, most entries go in automaticaly and you just adjust the dates/amounts if they change.
you can then analyse the data just by setting the correct filters on reports.
does cashflow and net worth dead easy.

Might also be a usefull tool for the business
I would try to use the same for both anyway whatever you choose.

I was allready familiar with the tool and when my parents died it took me a day to input all their data for over a year made sorting through the details very easy once everything was in,(they had quite complex finances including multiple benefits pensions shares etc) I could just pull out the info for tax returns and the estate inventory/account and tax returns.

The point I am making with a few hours you could probably create a full picture of 2015 and have a much better idea where you are , even just starting from 2016 wil make any future analysis very easy.

paper works just as well but is more time consuming to do analysis.
spreadsheets can be customized but I think the time is better spent getting an exiting tool to do the job and you get a load of extra stuff for no effort.

getmore4less

THe great thing with big long lists is you can end up spending so much time analysing and prioritizing you run out of time to do anything else.

Forward_thinking

Hiya getmore and m4rc, you two have been amazing. Many thanks. Please don't think that my short responses are ungrateful and you have wasted your time. I honestly read your posts again and again over the course of days.

You have a great point about the lists - I do tend to spend a couple of minutes at the end of the day planning for the next day. It keeps me focused. However, I used to really be into lists which wasted a lot of time. It all went wrong when I updated my phone and my app deleted all my lists. I haven't kept a comprehensive list ever since and really don't miss it. You have confirmed that this is the way to stay so thank you.

YNAB - think I am going to look at the one you mention getmore. I suspect it might work better for us as oh as told me there is no way he is going to work with pocket money! So I probably won't be able to be as precise as I would like in an ideal world.

M4rc - the Amazon Family has some great subscriptions for nappies and wipes. I have just ordered a month's supply for £15 - OH says we usually spend about £28-£30 so I'm really pleased. It's basically a 20% discount and then if you order 5 items you get a further 15% off the whole bill. I am going to resist this last temptation as there is nothing else I think we need off here. I did look at the Amazon pantry arrangement and looked at dishwasher tablets/soap powder but didn't feel it was any cheaper really.

Have just subscribed to Iceland and finalised the switch with Ovo. Just rang up about another car - no good we'll get there.

Right, off to get some lunch. Need to make it worth my while as I won't be having my third meal until about 8pm. My downfall is when all the children get in from the school and my house goes from serene to chaotic - usually I reach into the biscuit drawer but not today. Going to be tough but I am in a metamorphosis stage in every way.

enthusiasticsaver

I am another one who is dubious about YNAB FT. It looks far too complicated and time consuming to me. I use spreadsheets and a spending tracker on my phone to record every spend. I have used MS Money in the past but want to reduce the amount of time I spend on budgets and I really only need to know our spend for retirement purposes as that is our goal in three years time.


It is a shame your OH will not work within a budget as I found that really useful with my OH. An allowance went into his personal account, bills money and savings removed and a personal allowance into mine. He then did not mess up my budgets and we had savings accounts for holidays, large annual bills, replacement white goods, car expenses etc. Worked when we were on a really tight budget when our kids were small and works now although the allowance is higher now


I am another one on a healthy eating plan at the moment as put on way too much weight over Christmas and our holiday at end of last year. About 1 and a half stone to lose to get down to my ideal but I can do that easily in two or three months just by cutting out junk and alcohol and doing one extra keep fit class per week and walking to and from park and ride to work three days a week. Cheaper too I do snack on fruit twice a day though and a handful of nuts in the morning. Biscuits and chocolate are my downfall so am keeping away altogether from those as finding going cold turkey works better than rationing.


My daughter uses Amazon for baby nappies, wipes and cat food and says it is much cheaper than supermarkets with the right deals. I will mention the Amazon family subscription and see if she has looked into that. Good that your OH is on board with the savings anyway and hope you find a new car soon.

Forward_thinking

Enthusiastic saver - another one I am getting excited about when they post - my life is getting incredibly sad!!! OH is happy to work within a budget - the problem he states is that it varies from month to month depending on Xmas, birthdays etc. But my argument is that if we work out a monthly budget there will eventually be the money in there to cover this. At the moment he is pulling bits out here and there from the company rather than just taking one set amount. All very messy but I am very OCD when it comes to keeping things tidy. Once I get into this our accounts will be extremely neat and organised - it's the only way I work. This personality trait is a burden in many ways but also has many advantages e.g.. our house is lovely and tidy : ))

Enthusiasticsaver - go and google the s diet. It's the first one I've found that I think might actually work. I did something similar years ago and it worked excellently. Knowing you get the weekends off tends to help you keep to it and will probably work more effectively in the long term. We are also starting the screen time diet with the kids (only screen time on S days - although son has just incorporated F days for Fridays and friends ; /).

Right, off to do the school run. Really hoping I don't break down. My petrol light has been on for a few days and I have avoided getting any petrol, partly from laziness and secondly from just trying to save. This one isn't going to work really though is it? Wish me luck. And thanks!

m4rc

I will look into Amazon Family FT - look at you passing on money saving tips!!

I agree with getmore4less and enthusiasticsaver - YNAB isn't really what you need. It's great for micro managing every penny, but even then it's very complicated even if people say you get used to it. It would drive me insane if I'm honest!

And yes as getmore4less says you can spend your day on lists if you want to waste a bit of time, then you can pretend you are organised for the next day. Next morning start on more lists, never get anything done!

Forward_thinking

:rotfl: I'm great at this money-saving lark me thinks. Anyone discovered shopitize?

Forward_thinking

These are good too - just arrived - 10 cards for £2.50. Will get the kids to make their own but on the odd occasion these are great....

Amazon - Tallon Just To Say Kids Birthday Card (Box of 10)

Forward_thinking

I was robbed!!!!!! Obviously haven't perfected the art just yet - could have got them with another seller for £2.20!!!