If we vote for Brexit what happens

mwpt

bugslet wrote: »

mwpt, I do understand that, but you asked what the problem with immigration was besides house prices.

You are talking about the big picture, I was talking on an individual level.

To the person who used to earn £10.00 and now earns £7.50, costs coming down seems remote. They just know that they earn less and that £2.50 x 40 hours ( probably more if you factor in overtime ) is not made up with those lower costs.

I've just found out that my IFA, who is working on his second masters so not an uneducated chap, is voting out. From previous conversations I suspect my accountant will as well, again not an uneducated man.

Yes fair points bugslet and I can understand why that would convince someone to vote 'out'.

Just an example though about my answer, I speak from personal experience. I work in a fairly niche field, I built up a lot of experience over the years but it is in an industry where jobs are easily offshored as other countries skill up. Wary about this, I preempted it by resigning last year and am trying a new 'thing'. I'm still unsure if I've done the right thing, so may just end up back in my previous type of role. But the point is, immigration or no immigration, my type of role could be at risk (though the best will survive).

angrypirate

mayonnaise wrote: »

And our far right anti-immigration party came first in the 2014 EU elections with 27% of the vote. Not sure what your point is to be honest.

For the record, I have never voted UKIP but just to put some facts straight
UKIP is not far right (in fact some of their policies are less right wing than the tories)
UKIP are not anti immigration

UKIP advocate an immigration policy more like Australia - skills based with all immigrant required to speak english and have their own medical insurance. It also wouldnt be discriminatory unlike now where our policy is discriminatory in favour of EU countries. Why should it be easier for unskilled people from Romania to come here than skilled people from India / Australia / New Zealand?

Generali

angrypirate wrote: »

UKIP advocate an immigration policy more like Australia - skills based with all immigrant required to speak english and have their own medical insurance. It also wouldnt be discriminatory unlike now where our policy is discriminatory in favour of EU countries. Why should it be easier for unskilled people from Romania to come here than skilled people from India / Australia / New Zealand?

As an immigrant living in Australia the picture you paint of Australian immigration policy is not one I recognise.

Tromking

mayonnaise wrote: »

And our far right anti-immigration party came first in the 2014 EU elections with 27% of the vote. Not sure what your point is to be honest.

I think it's a bit of a stretch to call UKIP far right. They advocate stricter controls on immigration and the return of UK sovereignty, but the moment we leave the EU they cease to exist and return to the Tory party. We are undoubtedly assisted slightly by our electoral system, but nethertheless far right European style fascism does not exist in the UK as it does in mainland Europe.
My point is that there is a 'progressive' case to be made for Brexit and if Corbyn wasn't Labour leader, he`d probably be making it.
Too easy for some for some on here to call those considering vote leave xenophobes and closet racists.

kabayiri

Generali wrote: »

But you can't just have a free market for everyone else and have your own industry featherbedded.

If you want to benefit from being able to buy your groceries from a bunch of stores that are competing on price, quality and service; be able to take advantage of the huge breakthroughs in technology; be able to live a longer, healthier life that has resulted from Big Pharma's immense leaps forward in products then you also have to live with competition in your own industry.

That's a greater good argument, and in times of prosperity I think it really does work.

It becomes a difficult political sell though, when people find themselves struggling in austere times.

Most people will vote in actual or perceived self interest. I'd make more money from immigration outside the EU.

The way things are going, the people I work with will just end up shifting more work wholesale out to India and South Africa. You can't even look in the UK now for certain IT skills; there just isn't enough resource.

angrypirate

Generali wrote: »

As an immigrant living in Australia the picture you paint of Australian immigration policy is not one I recognise.

In what sense? I was under the impression that they had a skills based points system with an English speaking requirement.

kabayiri

Tromking wrote: »

I think it's a bit of a stretch to call UKIP far right. They advocate stricter controls on immigration and the return of UK sovereignty, but the moment we leave the EU they cease to exist and return to the Tory party.
...

I think Boris is cleverly positioning himself to take advantage of these voters.

We will see political changes regardless of the EU ref result IMO.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Tromking wrote: »

Too easy for some for some on here to call those considering vote leave xenophobes and closet racists.

Some who are planning to vote leave are in fact xenophobes and racists.

And that number is probably higher than you think...

CLAPTON

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Some who are planning to vote leave are in fact xenophobes and racists.

And that number is probably higher than you think...

presumably the sample was properly randomised so many of those that admitted to 'racial prejudice' were ethic Indians, Pakistani, Africans and Europeans and 'other' UK citizens.

mayonnaise

Rinoa wrote: »

Just for those who believe all trade with the EU will cease after Brexit.

I can't think of anyone who believes that.