If we vote for Brexit what happens

michaels

Suppose immigration lead to a majority for Catholicism in the UK and thus an electoral mandate for banning abortion and contraception. Or a majority for Islam and thus an electoral mandate for Sharia law. IS there no level of immigration that would be so high as to change the fundamental nature of the UK and thus not in the interests of current UK citizens?

Note that I am in favour of Brexit because it will give us national democratic control over decisions that affect UK citizens. Personally I would then vote for parties that favoured large scale immigration of a mix that brings most benefit to the country and all its citizens - so potentially fewer unskilled workers from low income European economies and more Chinese and Indian graduates, Filipino nurses, Australian doctors etc.

kabayiri

Generali wrote: »

Did you never read of the massacre of the London plumbers? It was a battle waged between indigenous plumbers and Polish invaders.
...

Londoners again eh?

It's not my fault if they are too soddin' tight to spend proper money on trades people, but look for the cheapest option. I suppose you don't need a good job when converting that shed into the latest EE des-res.

You don't get that up 'ere in the Grim North.

We do the decent thing and pay people on the side

mwpt

danothy wrote: »

I don't think that "practicality" justifies racism, nor do I think that "pragmatism" of placating the racists that would be violent if we did not placate them justifies it either. It's telling how these people baulk at the idea that natives should be held to the same standards they advocate for non-natives.

I'm sorry I don't really understand that paragraph. I don't see what practicalities has to do with racism.

You cannot simply open a relatively rich first world countries borders and not expect millions and millions of arriving immigrants. I'm not sure if you've been to countries and seen how most of the rest of the world live (I presume you have). The attraction to come and live in a prosperous country is enormous.

Presumably, it would be racist to not offer state benefits and housing to arriving immigrants. So the state would have to find homes and provide for those that didn't immediately have jobs. This would be a completely fair model but my bet is it would cause a collapse of services, large scale social unrest and violence.

I favour open borders and free movement, as a long term goal and so we should continue moving towards that goal. To suggest that it would not work on a short time scale and would cause more harm than good is not racist.

kabayiri

I'll set my stall out here.

I'm not a fan of 'freedom of movement' because it is fundamentally a stupid concept.

I'm not even a fan of freedom of movement in the UK.

We all know most of the decent jobs are in London.

With freedom of movement, that should obviously be a call to arms for all the Geordie; Scouse; and Manc massive to move there then : lock stock and barrel. London would be awash with people.

Bigger London = more income = more people.

They wouldn't need to film Dredd 2. Just turn up with a handycam in London in a few years time to observe MegaCity One.

mwpt

Your view is noted kabayiri, but it will one day be consigned to antiquated views such as banning same sex marriage, no votes for women, and such.

The world moves inexorably forward and as we gradually civilise, the notion of nationalism will slowly die off.

It'll take a long long time but it'll happen.

Yolina

michaels wrote: »

Suppose immigration lead to a majority for Catholicism in the UK and thus an electoral mandate for banning abortion and contraception.

France is Catholic... abortions and contraception are certainly not banned there.

Generali

kabayiri wrote: »

Londoners again eh?

It's not my fault if they are too soddin' tight to spend proper money on trades people, but look for the cheapest option. I suppose you don't need a good job when converting that shed into the latest EE des-res.

You don't get that up 'ere in the Grim North.

We do the decent thing and pay people on the side

Perhaps we could have a whip round to get you a place slightly further south. Maybe start with the Midlands and try it from there.

Generali

Yolina wrote: »

France is Catholic... abortions and contraception are certainly not banned there.

The French state is very much not Catholic. It observes a strict separation of religion and state. Hence the Burka ban.

Yolina

We do indeed have separation of the State and the Church (and therefore for instance state schools ban any display of religion - whatever the religion) but the population is overwhelmingly Catholic, yet you don't really see anyone clamouring for a ban on contraception or abortions.

mayonnaise

Yolina wrote: »

We do indeed have separation of the State and the Church

We could do with a bit of that in the UK.