If we vote for Brexit what happens

Conrad

Arklight wrote: »

People go where the jobs are. Brexit will do nothing to stop illegal immigration and legal migrants will still head to London and the South East, like everyone else in the UK.

With 'progressives' in charge of so many spheres of public life, such things are indeed impossible to fix.


My hope is the public become ever more aware of the damage wrought in the name of 'progressive' sensibility, and demand change.


We could deter mass immigration quite easily given the right resolve and a common sense approach without whining hand wringers dumbing everything down.

setmefree2

A_Medium_Size_Jock wrote: »

I see that the EU's Budget Commissioner Gunther Oettinger has been reported in Der Spiegel discussing increasing contributions from existing member states:

http://www.politico.eu/article/oettinger-tells-eu27-to-expect-to-cough-up-after-brexit/

We WONT fill gap! Wealthy Sweden says it WILL NOT make up EU budget shortfall post-Brexit

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/784524/Sweden-urges-EU-budget-cap-Brexit-financial-gap

setmefree2

kabayiri wrote: »

My argument is for a planned long term approach to investment in the UK, where you bolster the infrastructure *before* you increase the numbers of people in that area significantly.

I just don't see how a simplistic notion like FoM helps with that.

Surely labour should follow jobs? There is nothing wrong with advertising roles across Europe, but when over 100,000 arrive in the UK from the EU without even a job to go to, then just how do you plan and cope?

There are cases of Hounslow housing department just reallocating families who arrive to places like Stoke or Liverpool.

That's not planning. That's crisis management.

An EU which is on the ball is one which spots issues with EU policy and adapts accordingly. This is just as true with the resistance of Eastern European states to accept non-Christian migrant refugees, by the way.

Instead, the EU has high minded principles and is willing to let many of the citizens suffer.

Red lines mean nothing if they don't work for the citizens of Europe, particularly the forgotten portion.

FoM is a mess. For example, Lithuania has lost a quarter of it's population and there are areas of Poland that are only populated by the old. Tilting Eastern Europe and pouring all its young into the more developed west is dumb, not just from a British perspective.

The idea that Britain could carry on absorbing a million (and potentially more - who knows how bad it would have gotten if we hadn't had a Leave vote) extra people every three years was madness. And a problem never ever addressed correctly by the Remain campaign.

Herzlos

Conrad wrote: »

Yes I tend to ignore the old Trawler man with a lifetimes experience at sea - his intuitions and experience as to what fish are where is merely anecdote, his experiences an irrelevance.

What fish are is pretty finite. Would you rely on your trawler man to tell you about the best fishing spots in a sea he's never visited? Or about how to catch freshwater fish in a lake he's never seen? Or how busy a harbour he's never used is?

You're right none of us can tell a thing from our day to day lived experiences of the area we call home.

You can tell plenty about your own local sphere, but you've got no way to establish that your experience is the same as anyone in the same town as you, let alone in a different county. So you can't use local anecdotes as a driver for national policy.

setmefree2

A_Medium_Size_Jock wrote: »

An interesting article in the Financial Times about Germany's role in the future of Europe:



https://www.ft.com/content/08844954-0fe2-11e7-b030-768954394623

(Search "Germany holds the key to the future of Europe" if you find the link paywalled.)

This.......

In early February, Germany announced a new record trade surplus: $281bn, versus $210bn for China. Peter Navarro, Mr Trump’s chief trade adviser, has accused Germany of exploiting the “grossly undervalued” implied Deutschmark exchange rate to the detriment of both its European neighbours and the US.
Effectively he is saying that Germany has gamed the whole European project in order to ensure extreme competitiveness for German exports.

setmefree2

A_Pict_In_A_Past_Life wrote: »

Is this perhaps not why London grows so fast when the rest of the UK does not?
Look at your own charts - the growth is centered around areas easily accessible and not around western Scotland, East Anglia or the southwest for example.

The South East is really paying the price now. The rail network can't cope, house prices are ludicrous, pollution is awful....

Herzlos

setmefree2 wrote: »

The South East is really paying the price now. The rail network can't cope, house prices are ludicrous, pollution is awful....

Why isn't the government fixing it?

setmefree2

FT reports 650,000 digital subscribers with boosts around last year's Brexit vote a

http://www.pressgazette.co.uk/ft-reports-650000-digital-subscribers-with-boosts-around-last-years-brexit-vote-and-us-election/

Moby

Conrad wrote: »

Yes I tend to ignore the old Trawler man with a lifetimes experience at sea - his intuitions and experience as to what fish are where is merely anecdote, his experiences an irrelevance.


You're right none of us can tell a thing from our day to day lived experiences of the area we call home.


Give me a chart

Confirmation bias. People see what their prejudices encourage them to see!

Filo25

setmefree2 wrote: »

http://www.pressgazette.co.uk/ft-reports-650000-digital-subscribers-with-boosts-around-last-years-brexit-vote-and-us-election/

I was one of them!

At least the FT does draw a clearer line between news and editorialising, compared to the rest of our print media.