If we vote for Brexit what happens

Herzlos

CLAPTON wrote: »

why don't you think that the EU hasn't guaranteed the residency rights of the UK expat as equally disgusting, and that this will shame the EU for decades to come?

Because:

1. The EU hasn't called them "bargaining chips"
2. The EU is being perfectly reasonable in it's no-discussion stance. As far as it's concerned, the ball is in the UK's court regarding arrangements.
3. They were even going further than that, in that one of their representatives was talking about offering EU citizenship to uk citizens that wanted one.

Surely you can see how that differs from Mays plan?

Herzlos

CLAPTON wrote: »

what exactly is the UK posturing : don't you expect article 50 to be enacted?

The UK wants to start negotiations before stating the clock. The EU wants the UK to get on with it and stop all the economic uncertainty.

Once May triggers A50 the EU will start discussions. At that point, which side do you think it's going to be more pro-expats? The side that wants to use them as bargaining chips, or the side that's already explored ways to give them a way to maintain their status?

CLAPTON

Herzlos wrote: »

The UK wants to start negotiations before stating the clock. The EU wants the UK to get on with it and stop all the economic uncertainty.

so the EU are using the ex-pat people as a bargaining chip to force May to enable article 50 : quite disgusting.

Once May triggers A50 the EU will start discussions. At that point, which side do you think it's going to be more pro-expats? The side that wants to use them as bargaining chips, or the side that's already explored ways to give them a way to maintain their status?

I would think the worse side would the one that has already REFUSED to discuss the matter.

It is inconceiveable that the UK will chuck out any non criminal EU citizens that obey the residency rules.

Ballard

Conrad wrote: »

Fair value level as explained previously as recommended by IMF and others pre-referendum

Just so that I've got this right... we trust the experts view on exchange rates but ignore their views on everything else?

Thrugelmir

Herzlos wrote: »

The UK wants to start negotiations before stating the clock. The EU wants the UK to get on with it and stop all the economic uncertainty.

Do you have inside information that none of us are aware of?

Conrad

The more I think about it, perhaps we should be absolutely minded to offer continued free trade or just tell the Brussels leviathan to poke it, and we go WTO. Business will adapt no problem, and we owe Brusells nothing at all, no long winded squabble, and end to uncertainty, clean.

Yes I understand the supply chain argument, equivalence and the rest, all are easily accommodated and we could pull all sorts of moves on corporation tax etc

Loving the idea of a quick clean break and leaving the squabble club far behind. People will still trade regardless.

sann420

Using immigrants as bargaining chips is the brilliant idea of Mother May. As far as I know nobody else in her govt or the EU side has suggested such petty politics.

Even as home secretary she had a track record of picking on the weak.

She needs to go. This woman seriously gives me the creeps. We need to have a general election ASAP.

With both France and Germany going into general elections, triggering A50 in March is stupid.

vivatifosi

sann420 wrote: »

She needs to go. This woman seriously gives me the creeps. We need to have a general election ASAP.

Who do you think will be running the country if we have a general election asap? It would be Theresa May, exactly as it is now. Labour and the Lib Dems won't make much of an impact and she will grow her majority.

vivatifosi

Conrad wrote: »

The more I think about it, perhaps we should be absolutely minded to offer continued free trade or just tell the Brussels leviathan to poke it, and we go WTO. Business will adapt no problem, and we owe Brusells nothing at all, no long winded squabble, and end to uncertainty, clean.

Yes I understand the supply chain argument, equivalence and the rest, all are easily accommodated and we could pull all sorts of moves on corporation tax etc

Loving the idea of a quick clean break and leaving the squabble club far behind. People will still trade regardless.

Do you honestly believe that going to WTO will be a "quick clean break"? That it isn't worth negotiating with the EU at all?

Your statement that we will owe Brussels nothing is factually incorrect. We will end up owing as part of the disengagement exercise. We can argue over the amounts, but we will pay something.

Going straight to WTO without trying to negotiate a settlement with the EU will not leave us better off, it will be a missed opportunity. Yes, it is good to identify opportunities to trade with the rest of the world, but the fact remains that there is still a huge market starting 22 miles away from us.

Obviously going to the WTO should be one of our options when negotiating. It shouldn't however be the only option or something that we flounce off and do in a huff without exploring all other possibilities.

TrickyTree83

sann420 wrote: »

Using immigrants as bargaining chips is the brilliant idea of Mother May. As far as I know nobody else in her govt or the EU side has suggested such petty politics.

Even as home secretary she had a track record of picking on the weak.

She needs to go. This woman seriously gives me the creeps. We need to have a general election ASAP.

With both France and Germany going into general elections, triggering A50 in March is stupid.

Momentum member by any chance?