If we vote for Brexit what happens

Herzlos

CLAPTON wrote: »

It is true that the English have long championed for people to be able to choose their own form of government.

The Scots, Irish, Welsh, and Colonies would all disagree with that.

In fact, beyond the UK GE's, which strongly favour 1 of 2 parties, can you provide a single example where England has had any involvement in improving democracy? The Falklands?

I mean, you've had several wars to prevent people having a say in their own governance.

Masomnia

Herzlos wrote: »

The Scots, Irish, Welsh, and Colonies would all disagree with that.

In fact, beyond the UK GE's, which strongly favour 1 of 2 parties, can you provide a single example where England has had any involvement in improving democracy? The Falklands?

I mean, you've had several wars to prevent people having a say in their own governance.

The Falklands is a good example!

The_Last_Username

Herzlos wrote: »

The Scots, Irish, Welsh, and Colonies would all disagree with that.

Really?
Is that why they are all still determined to be a part of the UK?
Despite their own referenda?
And why is the Commonwealth is so strong nowadays?

CLAPTON

Herzlos wrote: »

The Scots, Irish, Welsh, and Colonies would all disagree with that.

In fact, beyond the UK GE's, which strongly favour 1 of 2 parties, can you provide a single example where England has had any involvement in improving democracy? The Falklands?

I mean, you've had several wars to prevent people having a say in their own governance.

it seems to me that Scotland
Wales
NI
all wish to be part of the UK

others

Canada
Australia
New Zealand
were given independence

by comparison with other countries we didn't do so bad.

much of the EU is free because we fought and died so they could be free.

Sapphire

CLAPTON wrote: »

much of the EU is free because we fought and died so they could be free.

With the help of a few other countries, notably the United States. And did you know that two Polish squadrons took part in the Battle of Britain? The pilots were noted for their ferocious bravery (or recklessness, as some would have it, but they were fighting for their country's freedom). Unfortunately, though, it was a long time before their country was 'free'.

CLAPTON

Sapphire wrote: »

With the help of a few other countries, notably the United States. And did you know that two Polish squadrons took part in the Battle of Britain? The pilots were noted for their ferocious bravery (or recklessness, as some would have it, but they were fighting for their country's freedom). Unfortunately, though, it was a long time before their country was 'free'.

I did indeed know that the USA was involved and also of the very important contribution of the Polish pilots especially in our hour of need during the battle of Britain.
Yes the USA was wrong to trust Stalin.

Shakethedisease

Halfway house for years..

Philip Hammond says post-Brexit transitional deal will be needed

Deal after negotiations end in March 2019 will be needed to avoid serious risks to businesses and financial stability, says chancellor

Speaking at the Treasury select committee, the chancellor said that almost all civil servants, many businesses and “thoughtful politicians” were starting to accept that a transitional deal after the Brexit negotiations conclude in March 2019 would be necessary to avoid serious risks to businesses and financial stability.

Businesses are concerned that the Brexit process will see the UK kicked out of the EU after a two-year negotiation following article 50. In theory, that will mean leaving the union before a formal trade deal is agreed, resulting in fears of a “cliff-edge” scenario for companies. A transitional deal could either mean extending the negotiating period, or agreeing to a softer deal that would act as a bridge to a full exit.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/dec/12/philip-hammond-calls-for-post-brexit-transitional-deal?CMP=share_btn_tw

ruggedtoast

Arleen wrote: »

You do not have a free movement if you have to be allowed to pass a border. It's like with freedom of speech, you either are free to speak what do you want, or you don't. And you either are free to pass to any country, or you aren't. And with the UK out of Schengen you aren't free to enter or leave as you please, and the minimum restriction is to have valid documents, with circumstances which can deny you entry.
Something people participating in Schengen cannot enforce (in theory, in practice we saw what happened during migrant crisis), as they have free movement.

As much as I reel to find myself in the bizarre, and utterly novel, situation of defending Clapton's argument; he is right and you are wrong.

The Schengen Zone is passport free travel. You need papers to the enter the UK but there is no further border control other than looking for wanted criminals, customs abuses, or forged passports. Nor are there any restrictions on work. This is free movement. I can't imagine why you think otherwise.

/goes off to hyperventilate

ruggedtoast

CLAPTON wrote: »

you have repeatedly made it plain that you only feel comfortable with people from white christian european countries but you really must break down this xenophobia and try to engage with the peoples of Africa, Indian China, SE Asia, the Americas etc.
It's unlikely that you will ever be comforatbale with them but just try not to actually hate them and try to treat them as human beings.

I have seen some spelling disasters I never thought possible from you, but "comforatbale"?

I really wish you would contain your problem with white people and middle eastern religions. It must give you awful cognitive dissonance, as you rattle your biscuit tin in honour of a privileged woman you apparently believe was ordained by (Middle Eastern) God to look down on you.

I have lived and / or worked in every one of the regions you mention. Apart from "Indian China" - that one has passed me by.

Thrugelmir

Quote:
Originally Posted by CLAPTON
much of the EU is free because we fought and died so they could be free.

How many years did many suffer under Russian rule though?