Halifax - Unplanned Overdraft Fees

ben85

Sorry if I'm posting in the wrong place? Just wanted to share my story and see if anyone else out there is going through the same ordeal.

On the 2nd of November the balance in my Halifax account was 0.95 pence. Later that day they charged me £10.00 in 'Unplanned Overdraft Fees' making my balance -£9.05. On the 3rd of November I used my contactless debit card with Halifax to pay for £3.78 of goods in Morrison's. This mean that my new balance was -£12.83.

My balance remained -£12.83 until the 19th of November when I saw what the balance was and paid in as much as I could, £10.36. Meaning a new balance of -£2.47. The following day I was paid from work and my account then went back into credit.

Ultimately I was over the £10 buffer on my account by £2.83 for 16 days. As a result Halifax now want to charge me £80.00 at the beginning of January. £5 x 16 days = £80.

I rang up and spoke to their Customer Services team and they put me through to a 'Complaints Manager'. She was willing to knock off £25 but this was their final decision. She said I could either accept verbally or reject. I rejected, but said they should still write to me and offer the £25 reduction as I can't afford to pay £55 or £80 so they might as well be chasing me for £55.

They said that I have no right to appeal and that this was their full and final decision. They told me my only option was the Ombudsman.

They have sent out the final decision letter and gave me a reference of: 9990178. They said if this £55 charges makes me overdrawn again in January to contact their 'Money Management' team and reach an agreement to pay this money back.

They don't seem to understand that it's not their charges and what they've done that I dispute. It's their ethics. How can it be fair to be charged £80 for a mere £2.83? I can't and won't pay this which will probably meant debt agencies and more problems.

I've written to the Ombudsman but is there anything else I can do?

Really appreciate any kind of help. I know it's my fault but can't help but think the punishment doesn't fit the crime.

Thanks,

Ben

colsten

ben85 wrote: »

On the 2nd of November the balance in my Halifax account was 0.95 pence. Later that day they charged me £10.00 in 'Unplanned Overdraft Fees' making my balance -£9.05. On the 3rd of November I used my contactless debit card with Halifax to pay for £3.78 of goods in Morrison's. This mean that my new balance was -£12.83.

There must be something missing in your transaction history. They wouldn't have suddenly charged you £10 if you had not exceeded your overdraft buffer before. You also get fair notice of overdraft charges before they get actually applied to your account, so your missing transactions probably go back to September. what are those transactions, and what does your October statement say?

What type of Halifax account do you have? On a "current account" or a "student current account" you have a £10 overdraft buffer, and £50 on their other accounts.
http://www.halifax.co.uk/bankaccounts/overdrafts/

You have probably encountered this for the first time, and you could have got the charges waived if you had asked nicely as all banks will be lenient on the first charge. It sounds as if you rubbed them up the wrong way? You could try to ring them again and beg for the charges to be waived, on the grounds that you were silly to ignore the T&Cs and charges that are published and were available to you ever since you opened the account.

ben85 wrote: »

I can't and won't pay this which will probably meant debt agencies and more problems.

this is cutting off your nose to spite your face. Don't be silly. Don't ruin your financial future because you made a mistake and ignored the rules that apply to your current account.

If you cannot convince them to waive the charges, your next best bet would be to follow their suggestion and talk to their Money Management Team. Being desperate is better than being bolshy if you have to talk to them.

chris_m

What do the Terms and Conditions - to which you agreed - state?

ben85

I've just got a bog standard current account so the buffer is £10.

The £10 charge was for previous misdemeanour's unfortunately. 2 days of being overdrawn, i.e. 2 x £5 = £10.

I chose paperless account management so my notification of this charge was a message to my online banking.

Unfortunately their T&C's do me no good. I hoped their goodwill would see that the charges for what occurred are totally unreasonable but they said their decision was final.

Kim_13

You should always set up an authorised overdraft if you know that you're getting near to zero. In that case, they would charge £1 per day rather than £5.

Most if not all banks charge similarly for Unauthorised Overdrafts.

They have had this fee structure for years so they are not going to suddenly agree that the fees are unreasonable.

From their point of view, unauthorised overdrafts are less likely to be paid back, so they would charge more to reflect this, just as credit card companies will charge more to people with poor/limited history.

ben85

I get where you're coming from but by highlighting that 'they've been doing it for years' it just shows that more needs to be done about it.

I borrowed £12.83 for 16 days. An £80 charge is a disgrace and whether or not that's because they deem it less likely to be paid back it's still disgusting.

I appreciate your reply and even though I may be unsuccessful I'll still pursue the Ombudsman route.

colsten

ben85 wrote: »

The £10 charge was for previous misdemeanour's unfortunately. 2 days of being overdrawn, i.e. 2 x £5 = £10.

Why didn't you settle those unfortunate previous misdemeanours previously??? It would have been a lot cheaper if you had done so. And you know that.

ben85 wrote: »

I get where you're coming from but by highlighting that 'they've been doing it for years' it just shows that more needs to be done about it.

I am sorry to disagree with you but what needs to be done about it is that the party that ignores the T&Cs needs to wake up and understand that a mutual agreement applies to both parties (as you would expect).

As consumers, we rightly all want to be taken serious. We therefore can ask companies for clear and unambiguous terms and conditions and clearly published charges. Once we agree to such T&Cs and charges, we can hold the company to their word. Equally, the company can expect us to be truthful to our assurance that we have agreed to the terms that define our relationship.

What in the Halifax T&Cs do you find unacceptable and/or unfair, and why did you agree to these unacceptable/unfair terms when you opened your account?

The terms include the right of the account holder to take a dispute to the Financial Ombudsman. It is unlikely that the Ombudsman will rule against the bank if the bank have not broken any T&Cs.

Regardless off the Ombudsman ruling, you can still take the bank to Court, as if either of us breaks the terms, both of us have the rights to take the other party to Court (as defined by the terms we both agreed to).

You can disagree with these principles of doing business but you will have to accept that businesses might turn down your custom if you are unable to adhere to the T&Cs. It is a great achievement of our democratic country that any business relationship (such as holding an account with a bank) is governed by published terms and conditions. You also have the democratic right to decline any T&Cs you don't like, as has the bank. But neither party can simply turn round and say they now, with immediate effect, don't like their previous commitments and demand some instant different rules. Which is what you seem to be doing by saying you no longer want to stick to your commitment on how much you'd pay for using your partner's money without your partner's agreement.

Dobbibill

ben85 wrote: »

On the 2nd of November the balance in my Halifax account was 0.95 pence. Later that day they charged me £10.00 in 'Unplanned Overdraft Fees' making my balance -£9.05. On the 3rd of November I used my contactless debit card with Halifax to pay for £3.78 of goods in Morrison's. This mean that my new balance was -£12.83.

You would have been notified of these charges in October, which were incurred in September. There would have been a letter on your internet banking inbox and an email to tell you about this if you have kept your email address up to date.

A couple of things to consider...

Why did this originally happen in September? You need to address why it happened in the first place, to prevent it happening again.

Is it likely to happen again? Be honest with yourself.

Have a look at setting up text alerts if you run a balance that is close to or may go over your limit.

Think about speaking to their Money Management Team to put a plan in place, their direct number is 0808 145 0379 (Lines open 8am - 9pm Monday - Friday and 8am - 5pm on Saturdays) maybe even ask about their 'Control' feature if you fear this is going to happen a 3rd time or more.

Use the mobile app daily so you can keep a better check on what money you have available.

Avoid using the contactless feature as this doesn't hit your available balance immediately and just debits the amount spent when the retailer is ready to take it.

I do agree with others though, you've made the error, twice, so don't cut off your nose to spite your face. You agreed to the T&C's, you can't now jump on the unethical soap box.

HTH

takman

ben85 wrote: »

I get where you're coming from but by highlighting that 'they've been doing it for years' it just shows that more needs to be done about it.

I borrowed £12.83 for 16 days. An £80 charge is a disgrace and whether or not that's because they deem it less likely to be paid back it's still disgusting.

I appreciate your reply and even though I may be unsuccessful I'll still pursue the Ombudsman route.

But it's anot unauthorised overdraft so your taking money from them that they didn't agree to let you borrow. I think a £5 a day fee is fair because it encourages people to pay it back sooner rather than later. You shouldn't have left it so long to pay it back and if you chose to do everything online you should be checking your balance more regularly.

SnowTiger

Ask Halifax for a letter of deadlock and then take the matter to the FOS.

Going to the FOS will cost Halifax time and money. Tell the FOS you believe a fee of £80 for a loan of £2.83 for sixteen days is disproportionate and that it has caused you hardship.

Even if you lose your case, Halifax will have lost more.

Companies can write whatever like in to Terms and Conditions. That doesn't make their fair, legal or enforceable. Much of this website's reputation has been built on highlighting that.

colsten

SnowTiger wrote: »

Much of this website's reputation has been built on highlighting that.

Much of this website's campaigning has contributed to the advent of daily overdraft fees, rather than the %ages that were previously charged and apparently were too hard to understand.