Hotpoint urgent tumble dryer recall

Zandoni

AJXX wrote: »

You need to clarify exactly what you mean by "knowing about it" because thus far you've said two different things (potentially without realising it).

As I said earlier, there is a big difference between them knowing about a safety issue and carelessly doing nothing about it (which is what I think you where trying to imply earlier) or them receiving reports about fires from machines in general.

Receiving reports about fires there's no doubt about that - bearing in mind though, this does not necessarily mean the machine is faulty and it would take them potentially years to eventually learn this was a design issue like we know now.

So which is it,

Reports about fires or are you going the whole hog and simply saying Hotpoint both knew there was a design flaw and sold dodgy machines for 11 years?

I'll go nearly the whole hog and say they knew for a very large percentage of those 11 years and continued to produce them.

powerful_Rogue

Zandoni wrote: »

You supply me with evidence that they didn't know and I'll agree with you 100%

That's not the way it works though. You're the one claiming it as a fact, so its for you to supply the proof.

Its pretty obvious by now that its not a fact and is simply your opinion. If I recall rightly, this isnt the first time you've been caught out claiming something is a fact when it clearly only an opinion.

wealdroam

Zandoni wrote: »

I'll go nearly the whole hog and say they knew for a very large percentage of those 11 years and continued to produce them.

Others have asked before, but I'll try one more time:

Please can you provide some sort of proof, evidence, writing, etc, that what you are saying - that Hotpoint 'have been churning out these faulty products for 11 years' - has any truth.

If you can't do that then I, and I am sure others, can only assume you are making it up.

Oh, and please don't come back and say "you prove otherwise and I'll agree with you", as that brings your whole campaign into disrepute.

Zandoni

powerful_Rogue wrote: »

That's not the way it works though. You're the one claiming it as a fact, so its for you to supply the proof.

Its pretty obvious by now that its not a fact and is simply your opinion. If I recall rightly, this isnt the first time you've been caught out claiming something is a fact when it clearly only an opinion.

That's just you saying that's not the way it works. I'm saying its a fact because it's obvious that fires haven't just started last year. You disagree so prove your case.

So sadly you haven't caught anyone out and If you can't see that then there's no help for you.

Zandoni

wealdroam wrote: »

Others have asked before, but I'll try one more time:

Please can you provide some sort of proof, evidence, writing, etc, that what you are saying - that Hotpoint 'have been churning out these faulty products for 11 years' - has any truth.

If you can't do that then I, and I am sure others, can only assume you are making it up.

Oh, and please don't come back and say "you prove otherwise and I'll agree with you", as that brings your whole campaign into disrepute.

I suppose the simple answer is that Hotpoint have admitted it themselves by saying that the affected machines go back 11 years.

powerful_Rogue

Zandoni wrote: »

That's just you saying that's not the way it works. I'm saying its a fact because it's obvious that fires haven't just started last year. You disagree so prove your case.

So sadly you haven't caught anyone out and If you can't see that then there's no help for you.

That's not disputed.

What's disputed is you saying that these machines have been manufactured for the last 11 years with the manufacture knowing there was a fault present.

If its a fact as you claim, then back it up with evidence. If not, then its only your opinion.

AJXX

ThumbRemote wrote: »

The information was in the public domain since a Which report in 2013.

On a 22% share of the market, Hotpoint accounted for 34% of fires - a fairly significant hike in the percentages.

You conveniently forgot to mention that Which themselves have stated that the higher figures could be the result of Hotpoint having a significantly higher market share than the other brands.

Another important point to raise with this data from Which is that the data is simply based on "number of fires" - this could basically mean anything therefore using this data in the current discussion is all but pointless. For all we know 30% of those fires could be down to poor maintenance rather than the issue currently at hand with the design.

ThumbRemote wrote: »

It then took a further two years for them to actually admit the problem.

Out of genuine interest do you have any further sources on this point? I suspect that such a delay could be Hotpoint investigating the issue, organising the recall program, liaising with safety bodies, trading standards, re-designing the back panel for many different models of machine and then manufacturing the replacement back panels etc....

Again this is what I mean by "simplistic" views, what I'd call "real world" things are not taken into account, you post the above statement as if they simply sat on their !!!!!! for two years, but we don't know that...

powerful_Rogue

Zandoni wrote: »

I suppose the simple answer is that Hotpoint have admitted it themselves by saying that the affected machines go back 11 years.

Which they now know about. That's completely different to what you are alleging which would be Hotpoint saying "We have been producing these machines knowing there was a fault present for the past 11 years"

Zandoni

powerful_Rogue wrote: »

Which they now know about. That's completely different to what you are alleging which would be Hotpoint saying "We have been producing these machines knowing there was a fault present for the past 11 years"

So do you honestly believe they have only just found the fault?

powerful_Rogue

Zandoni wrote: »

So do you honestly believe they have only just found the fault?

Without evidence to the contrary, yes.