Corbynomics: A Dystopia

ruggedtoast

ukcarper wrote: »

It should make you think if someone who has been a union member for many years and taken industrial action to protect their rights is know finding it impossible to support the Labour Party.

Who wouldn't take industrial action to protect their own rights?

Socialism includes social responsibility, which means protecting other people's rights.

I am wholly unmoved by the whining of 170 career politicians in the PLP concerning the plight of themselves, I am quite encouraged by Corbin's commitment to social responsibility.

Off to the Brighton rally tomorrow. I'm sure no one else will go because he's so unpopular and all. Unless any of the 12,000 people who were at Liverpool today decide they want an encore.

You might be able to read about it on social media because there is not a snowball's chance in hell the mainstream press will report it.

Mistermeaner

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Tax credits are a taxpayer subsidy to employers to allow them to pay below a minimum wage. If Blair had cared about working people he would just have used his enormous Commons majority to force employers to pay a living wage, rather than a minimum wage.

But he wouldn't be swanning around the world living a millionaire lifestyle now cashing in all the favours he'd handed out if he'd done that, would he?

Blair and Brown engineered the biggest transfer of wealth from low and middle income workers to the bourgeoisie in living memory.

its not a subsidy to business its a redistribution of wealth from those who earn to those who dont

If you increase a businesses cost through high minimum wage either everyone pays at the point of consumption (prices rise and hence high inflation) or the company simply employs people where they are cheaper to keep costs down (and unemployment rises).

Doing as you suggest would be massively detrimental to the economy, and hurt those on lower incomes/the most vulnerable the most

Mistermeaner

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Off to the Brighton rally tomorrow. I'm sure no one else will go because he's so unpopular and all. Unless any of the 12,000 people who were at Liverpool today decide they want an encore.

Im at a plant today where over 12000 people are employed doing productive work and paying taxes. That won't be in the MSM either

ukcarper

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Who wouldn't take industrial action to protect their own rights?

Socialism includes social responsibility, which means protecting other people's rights.

I am wholly unmoved by the whining of 170 career politicians in the PLP concerning the plight of themselves, I am quite encouraged by Corbin's commitment to social responsibility.

Off to the Brighton rally tomorrow. I'm sure no one else will go because he's so unpopular and all. Unless any of the 12,000 people who were at Liverpool today decide they want an encore.

You might be able to read about it on social media because there is not a snowball's chance in hell the mainstream press will report it.

The concern is long term Labour supporters are deserting the party and that combined with no swing voters voting Labour means Labour can not win. If MPs are deselected which is the threat many will stand agains new candidate compounding the problem, consigning us to a Tory government for many years probably with a large majority.

TrickyTree83

ukcarper wrote: »

The concern is long term Labour supporters are deserting the party and that combined with no swing voters voting Labour means Labour can not win. If MPs are deselected which is the threat many will stand agains new candidate compounding the problem, consigning us to a Tory government for many years probably with a large majority.

They don't care.

Their way or the highway. They couldn't possibly be getting it wrong.

TheNickster

The problem with Corbynomics is 1) There is no Corbynomics only empty slogans and 2) there is no recognition of the realities of living in a neoliberal world and no prospect of changing that in the near future 3) there is still no Labour economic plan put forward by McDonnell

I advised Corbyns economics team to learn fast. They didnot by David Blanchflower

Thrugelmir

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Politics is changing again.

Agreed. The Tories are moving in from the right. With another more centralist lady PM.

westernpromise

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Who wouldn't take industrial action to protect their own rights?

Socialism includes social responsibility, which means protecting other people's rights.

I am wholly unmoved by the whining of 170 career politicians in the PLP concerning the plight of themselves, I am quite encouraged by Corbin's commitment to social responsibility.

Off to the Brighton rally tomorrow. I'm sure no one else will go because he's so unpopular and all. Unless any of the 12,000 people who were at Liverpool today decide they want an encore.

You might be able to read about it on social media because there is not a snowball's chance in hell the mainstream press will report it.

Nothing personal but you do rather give the impression of being consumed by rage, hatred and envy. It might be worth reflecting on how often parties have won power with that attitude, and whether it ended well (for anyone).

We get that you hate Conservative voters, but very few other people do, and those who do already vote Labour anyway. So there are no votes in the "I hate you" strategy. What's more, you need to convert Conservative voters - quite a lot of them - into Labour ones if Labour is to get back into power. Telling them you hate them because they're loathsome and evil is not going to achieve this; it makes you look at best potty, and at worst, malicious and deranged. Who's going to read that and say Yep, malicious and deranged - Labour gets my vote! Not too many.

Nor is asserting that Labour was not in power between 1997 and 2010 "because Blair was a Tory" in any way helpful to your case. It just looks like you're trying to dodge defending Labour's record in government by denying it happened. This strongly suggests that if re-elected, a repeat performance is likely - because if Labour doesn't feel it has anything to apologise for, why wouldn't it do it all again? One of the most effective Conservative attack lines is that Labour always wrecks the economy; pretending that you didn't simply reinforces this.

Labour needs to win about 100 seats from here to form a government. Winning back every seat in Scotland would achieve nothing, because those are already opposition seats anyway. You need to gain and you need the Conservatives to lose seats. Necessarily that means they must lose some to Labour.

To give you an idea of how hard that is going to be, it means winning seats like Pendle, Worcester and Swindon South, where in 2015 the Tories won by 48 or 49% to 31%. That is how far into Conservative territory Labour must penetrate. Piling up votes in seats they already hold in Liverpool and Leeds won't help.

You might want to apply your energy to reflecting on that challenge, because outpourings of snarling bile simply cheer existing Conservative voters and do nothing to win them away.

setmefree2

TheNickster wrote: »

I advised Corbyns economics team to learn fast. They didnot by David Blanchflower

This bit made me laugh :rotfl:

Incidentally, if there were even the slightest prospect that he could become prime minister, the bond and equity markets would eat him for lunch.

TrickyTree83

westernpromise wrote: »

Nothing personal but you do rather give the impression of being consumed by rage, hatred and envy. It might be worth reflecting on how often parties have won power with that attitude, and whether it ended well (for anyone).

We get that you hate Conservative voters, but very few other people do, and those who do already vote Labour anyway. So there are no votes in the "I hate you" strategy. What's more, you need to convert Conservative voters - quite a lot of them - into Labour ones if Labour is to get back into power. Telling them you hate them because they're loathsome and evil is not going to achieve this; it makes you look at best potty, and at worst, malicious and deranged. Who's going to read that and say Yep, malicious and deranged - Labour gets my vote! Not too many.

Nor is asserting that Labour was not in power between 1997 and 2010 "because Blair was a Tory" in any way helpful to your case. It just looks like you're trying to dodge defending Labour's record in government by denying it happened. This strongly suggests that if re-elected, a repeat performance is likely - because if Labour doesn't feel it has anything to apologise for, why wouldn't it do it all again? One of the most effective Conservative attack lines is that Labour always wrecks the economy; pretending that you didn't simply reinforces this.

Labour needs to win about 100 seats from here to form a government. Winning back every seat in Scotland would achieve nothing, because those are already opposition seats anyway. You need to gain and you need the Conservatives to lose seats. Necessarily that means they must lose some to Labour.

To give you an idea of how hard that is going to be, it means winning seats like Pendle, Worcester and Swindon South, where in 2015 the Tories won by 48 or 49% to 31%. That is how far into Conservative territory Labour must penetrate. Piling up votes in seats they already hold in Liverpool and Leeds won't help.

You might want to apply your energy to reflecting on that challenge, because outpourings of snarling bile simply cheer existing Conservative voters and do nothing to win them away.

And splitting your own party into two is going to help achieve that apparently. I don't see it.