Corbynomics: A Dystopia

Generali

ukcarper wrote: »

As you know nothing is a simply as that, ideologically the unions are opposed to Trident but their primary responsibility is to look after thier members and that is why they didn't vote for motion.

Stuff is simple but not more simple than it can be.

ukcarper wrote: »

As an aside I don't think that opposing Trident means you are on the far left.

I agree. There is a Republican theme that would perfectly be against Trident. Trident doesn't protect the Motherland directly so isn't worth spending money on. I don't agree because I think that having nukes means that an opponent will think twice before invading and security is the first duty of a government.

What the flibbertygibbets do I know though?

antrobus

ukcarper wrote: »

...As an aside I don't think that opposing Trident means you are on the far left.

Eh?

You were the one that said "They might be to the left but not so far as oppose trident." You are the only person here suggesting that opposition to Trident means that you are on the far left.:rotfl:

Generali

antrobus wrote: »

Basically, yes.:)

I was simply pointing out that UKcarper was wrong. Out of the 'big unions' at least 4.5 of them are against Trident. The issue of why they did not want to take the opportunity to at least debate the issue at the Labour conference would be a different question altogether.

Okay, so we have a possible bottom line: the unions didn't like it but voted in favour anyway for whatever reason.

antrobus

Generali wrote: »

Okay, so we have a possible bottom line: the unions didn't like it but voted in favour anyway for whatever reason.

And it would also be the case that whilst some 'big unions' are indeed anti-Trident, it has no effect on internal Labour politics, because they are not affiliated to the Labour Party. The NUT would be an example.

Generali

antrobus wrote: »

And it would also be the case that whilst some 'big unions' are indeed anti-Trident, it has no effect on internal Labour politics, because they are not affiliated to the Labour Party. The NUT would be an example.

Some probably doesn't make 0.16% though. Just a thought.

michaels

To me the Trident issue is that Labour policy (as confirmed by conference) is that Trident should be renewed. Maria Eagle was sacked for saying this which seems a bit rich really considering Corbyn is all about Labour MPs are out of step with the membership and yet on this issue Corbyn is taking a different stance from the membership dictated party policy. IE the rules are the rules unless Corbyn doesn't like them in which case they aren't.

antrobus

michaels wrote: »

To me the Trident issue is that Labour policy (as confirmed by conference) is that Trident should be renewed. Maria Eagle was sacked for saying this which seems a bit rich really considering Corbyn is all about Labour MPs are out of step with the membership and yet on this issue Corbyn is taking a different stance from the membership dictated party policy. IE the rules are the rules unless Corbyn doesn't like them in which case they aren't.

True.

(Filler)

antrobus

Generali wrote: »

Some probably doesn't make 0.16% though. Just a thought.

Well, most unions are not affiliated to the Labour Party, Although of course the big three are. One would have thought that had Unison (for example) followed through on their policy their share of the vote would have amounted to more than 0.16% of the union vote, so presumably they chickened out for some reason.

I have no idea why.

Mistermeaner

Can you be a member of eg unison and separately also be a Labour party member and some how get 2 votes on stuff?

Labour seem a beauracratic nightmare, just as they were in government

Generali

antrobus wrote: »

Well, most unions are not affiliated to the Labour Party, Although of course the big three are. One would have thought that had Unison (for example) followed through on their policy their share of the vote would have amounted to more than 0.16% of the union vote, so presumably they chickened out for some reason.

I have no idea why.

It is bizarre. Most of the big unions claim to be against Trident yet all must have voted in favour or at least abstained.

Unite's policy does contain a caveat about union members' jobs being protected if Trident isn't renewed which I suspect is the key to the vote's outcome.

I'm not sure how the next step works. Conference has decided a policy which is to renew Trident. Presumably Mr Corbyn plans to vote against that policy. I don't understand why that is reasonable.