Corbynomics: A Dystopia

CLAPTON

ukcarper wrote: »

I wasn't there.

not first hand evidence then

ukcarper

CLAPTON wrote: »

not first hand evidence then

Reliable enough though.

CLAPTON

ukcarper wrote: »

Reliable enough though.

for some maybe, for others maybe not

ukcarper

gadgetmind wrote: »

Well, they clearly did feel that way, so the benefits clearly didn't outweigh the negatives in a pretty big way.

I don't understand the point you are trying to make. They didn't strike for some reason but when the terms and conditions were improved they were very happy to take them.

ukcarper

CLAPTON wrote: »

for some maybe, for others maybe not

You really do need to improve your debating style.

gadgetmind

ukcarper wrote: »

I don't understand the point you are trying to make.

The unions tend to annoy those they claim to represent almost as much as the rest of us.

They didn't strike for some reason

Morals, worth ethic, and a regard for their employers and customers, at a guess.

but when the terms and conditions were improved they were very happy to take them.

How on earth can you possibly know that? Maybe they were happy with the Ts&Cs before and were frankly sick to the back teeth of the union's politically-inspired meddling?

Given the anger (allegedly) shown at the blockade, isn't my guess more likely to be more accurate than yours?

ukcarper

gadgetmind wrote: »

The unions tend to annoy those they claim to represent almost as much as the rest of us.



Morals, worth ethic, and a regard for their employers and customers, at a guess.



How on earth can you possibly know that? Maybe they were happy with the Ts&Cs before and were frankly sick to the back teeth of the union's politically-inspired meddling?

Given the anger (allegedly) shown at the blockade, isn't my guess more likely to be more accurate than yours?

I if you are right why do they join Union. When on picket duty I had various responses from the general public more of which were in support than against.

More likely didn't want to lose pay

I know because they readily did even if they were happy before.

You seem to have a very blinkered view, there are good and bad trade union members as there are non members and managers.

gadgetmind

ukcarper wrote: »

if you are right why do they join Union.

They probably didn't. And even if they did, perhaps it was due to a closed shop and/or intimidation? Does the word "scab" ring any bells with you? It was used widely (probably still is) and not as a term of endearment.

You seem to have a very blinkered view, there are good and bad trade union members as there is non members and managers.

My view of unions comes from living through the 70s when they nearly destroyed this country, knowing a guy who seriously feared that he'd lose his life to union activists, and from my wife's direct experience of being sworn at and spat on for simply going to work.

We can't change the past, but please let's leave unions back in those dark days where they belong.

ukcarper

gadgetmind wrote: »

They probably didn't. And even if they did, perhaps it was due to a closed shop and/or intimidation? Does the word "scab" ring any bells with you? It was used widely (probably still is) and not as a term of endearment.



My view of unions comes from living through the 70s when they nearly destroyed this country, knowing a guy who seriously feared that he'd lose his life to union activists, and from my wife's direct experience of being sworn at and spat on for simply going to work.

We can't change the past, but please let's leave unions back in those dark days where they belong.

I lived and worked athrough the 70s as a trade union member and it was few high profile disputes that caused the problems and were reported on, while all the times unions and employers solved thier differences with minimal or no industrial action were not reported.
I willing joined trade union as did the majority of people at that time and closed shops were not the norm.

gadgetmind

ukcarper wrote: »

it was few high profile disputes that caused the problems and were reported on

A few? We really were in a bad shape for a very long time, and it could all have turned out very much worse if we hadn't pulled back from the brink.

I willing joined trade union as did the majority of people at that time and closed shops were not the norm.

The Labour party supported closed shops until 1989, and they were finally only made strictly illegal in 1990.

Before this, many hundreds of people were fired for no other reason than refusing to join a union, so it's little wonder that most gave in to the bullying, set their principles aside, and toed the line.