MSE News: Calls to 084, 087, 09 and 118 to be clearer, but prices vary wildly

michaels

Ian011 wrote: »

Their business model relied on some outdated regulation that applied only to calls made from BT lines. Many of those services aren't exactly clear in warning that their services will cost a fortune if called from another landline provider or from a mobile.

Some of these services will close. Others have introduced numbers starting 020, 03 or 080 for access. With these, the international leg of the call is paid for either by buying a top up in advance or via a separate monthly bill.

Does it cost BT any more to route calls to these numbers as opposed to other numbers that are generally a lot cheaper per minute and/or bundled as 'free' minutes or are they just blatantly profiteering?

How about services like 18185, are these also consigned to history?

Ian011

michaels wrote: »

Does it cost BT any more to route calls to these numbers as opposed to other numbers that are generally a lot cheaper per minute and/or bundled as 'free' minutes or are they just blatantly profiteering?

The term "free minutes" is misleading. These calls are "inclusive" when you pay a monthly fee. They are not "free".

BT's Rates:

01, 02, 03 - 9.85p per minute (inclusive if you have a BT call plan)

071-075, 077-079 - 12p per minute (6p per minute if you have the BT Anytime call plan or BT Home Phone Saver)

080, 0500 - free call

084, 087, 090, 091, 098, 118 - 9.85p per minute Access Charge plus Service Charge.

Non-inclusive calls to 01, 02, 03 and 07 numbers have a 15.97p connection fee.
Connection fees will no longer be allowed on calls to 084, 087, 09 and 118 numbers.

michaels wrote: »

How about services like 18185, are these also consigned to history?

18185 might set their Access Charge at 1p per minute, for example, and see a massive increase in their user base.

michaels

Thanks again

But will the 08 numbers be inclusive too in call plans? If not why not as presumably it will not cost BT any more to connect callers to these numbers than to any other numbers?

Ian011

Calls to 084 and 087 numbers should not be inclusive. The Service Charge can be up to £4.20 per hour for calls to 084 numbers and up to £7.80 per hour for calls to 087 numbers. Given that 084, 087 and 09 numbers should be used for third-party chargeable services paid for as the call is being made (such as recorded information lines including weather forecasts, sports results and horoscopes, entertainment services including competitions and voting on a TV show, subscription-free conference calling services and paying for small value goods and services through the phone bill, etc) the caller that made the call should pay for the service they used.

In general, 084 and 087 numbers are no longer used by retailers, traders and passenger transport companies for post sales helplines, no longer used by government departments and public services and no longer used by banks. The small number of such organisations that retain usage of these numbers will shortly have to face the reality of having to declare the Service Charge. Those who are unable to justify imposing a Service Charge on callers will have to change their number. Many such organisations have already changed to an 03 number.



See also
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5219756
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5220589

michaels

I agree they should pay the service provider for their bit but I don't see why they should also pay their telecoms company when they have already paid for a bundle of inclusive calls.

Ian011

How much would call package prices have to increase by if the Access Charge component was inclusive for the millions of calls made by people voting on XF, BGT, BB, SCD, etc, all the TV competitions, all the calls to horoscope and other recorded lines and to other such chargeable services?

If you never call those things would you be happy to effectively subsidise those who do?

samwardill

When sky introduced these changes they offered me chance to terminate my phone contract early without usual cancellation fees. O2 just communicated the changes but didn't offer me chance to terminate early. Is this because sky actually increased call charges but O2 did not. Or is it because of another reason?

Ian011

Whether they explicitly stated you can leave or not is irrelevant. If there is a material detriment you can leave.

At the point that Sky were letting people leave no-one else had announced their Access Charges. Just before the end of the 30 days, one other provider did announce their Access Charge. Anyone that left Sky may find that their new supplier has a higher Access Charge than Sky (but it will be only a fraction of a penny, or a penny or so, more).

While the cost of 084 and 087 is going up slightly, the cost of 09 and 118 will likely be coming down massively, especially on calls made from mobile phones.

zagfles

Doc_N wrote: »

Clearer?

Does Ofcom really regard this mess as in any way clear?

Sadly, it probably does - which says more about Ofcom than words can possibly describe.

Absolutely right there!

[PS - does anyone know whether 084 and 087 numbers will remain included (along with 03 numbers) in weekend, off-peak and all-inclusive 'packages' with companies such as BT, Plusnet and TalkTalk?]

Not with TalkTalk - they'll charge 5ppm access charge, plus the service charge, instead of being included!

I thought this was an utter rip-off until I saw this article and how much other are charging! So 0845/0844 numbers which used to either be included or charged at a few pence per minute are now going to cost maybe 5 or 10 times as much!

Yeah - this mess is really "transparent", it's clearly provided the telecom companies an excuse to massively hike the cost of these calls. There's no way it really costs them anywhere near 5ppm let alone 44ppm to terminate these calls.

zagfles

Ian011 wrote: »

How much would call package prices have to increase by if the Access Charge component was inclusive for the millions of calls made by people voting on XF, BGT, BB, SCD, etc, all the TV competitions, all the calls to horoscope and other recorded lines and to other such chargeable services?

If you never call those things would you be happy to effectively subsidise those who do?

Oh right, then we'll obviously see package prices coming down where 0845/0870 numbers were previously included. I await the TalkTalk announcement with baited breath.