being asked to train new staff.

Takeaway_Addict

bugslet wrote: »

If you are doing the same job ( for ease I'll discount your experience ), then you get the same pay. I'd be tempted to ask HR/director how on earth they expect you to work alongside two new people doing the same job as you for £10k less?

If I had to pay a new driver X pounds more to get him to come and work for me, then the rest of them would get a pay rise to match his.

There may be a company rule that states that they can't up your salary by 10%, but rules aren't set in stone. Everything has to be reviewed in a company and circumstances, be they driven by changes in regulations, whatever, means that sometimes what was a rule no longer makes sense.

I'd see someone and put it across calmly to them. It seems very unfair to me.

There is no legal requirement for pay to be 'fair', it just cannot discriminate against protected characteristics.

getmore4less

They can create a new job "senior" person that does the job that now we need to pay more for.

The idiot is the manager(s) that managed to get the approval for the new rate for new people WITHOUT putting budget in place for the existing people.( or maybe they have but are trying not to have to spend it)

They are not on your side, you need a careful look at your position in this place and you bosses, you are either deluded or being taken for a ride. Bosses bat for the people that make their place look good.

If you get the grief that you are not worth more, as suggested above book holiday.

Why can't the new people travel to your site for training.
Why is the documentation not good enough to take new people on.

Is there a good reason for the location is it new?
is this a move that will l have you made redundant
Companies hate giving pay rises to people they are planning to lose.

There is a secondary issue as to why this specialist support requirement is needed in the first place, where in the business is failing that creates this. Fix the source of the problems and they reduce.

Prothet_of_Doom

I like to think of work as a 2 way exploitation.


They exploit you because you are the best they can get at the price they want to pay, and they will pay you as little as you are prepared to accept.


You exploit them, because you are doing the least stressful job, that you are qualified to do, for the BEST terms and conditions you can get at the time (bearing in mind long term carrots, like vague promises of career progression, and a pension)


If you are not getting the best terms and conditions you could, there might be many reasons. a) Unfounded loyalty b) it's convenient, c) you are lazy d) 1001 other reasons.


The point is that HR rules are there to be broken, but you have to go about it the right way.


I'd be talking to recruitment agencies, about your actual value, and be looking to move on. I wouldn't threaten them, just resign, as soon as you get a better offer and when they panic, remind them that you did point out what the going rate for your skills are. Don't tell them what the new offer is.


IF they start to make you a better offer, tell them they have only one chance to put it right, and if their offer is double the increase that the new offer would give you accept it. If not tell them you would have stayed for 4 times the increase, but since they continue to insult your intelligence, you'll be working your notice as already tendered.

spirit

getmore4less wrote: »

They can create a new job "senior" person that does the job that now we need to pay more for.

The idiot is the manager(s) that managed to get the approval for the new rate for new people WITHOUT putting budget in place for the existing people.( or maybe they have but are trying not to have to spend it)yes, this doesn't make sense does it.

They are not on your side, you need a careful look at your position in this place and you bosses, you are either deluded or being taken for a ride. Bosses bat for the people that make their place look good. I suspect they will use me to pass on my knowledge to the new people and then get rid of me.

If you get the grief that you are not worth more, as suggested above book holiday. yes, have done some booking.

Why can't the new people travel to your site for training.
Why is the documentation not good enough to take new people on.sorry, what do you mean?

Is there a good reason for the location is it new?
is this a move that will l have you made redundant i wouldn't mind it that was the case. they need my knowledge first though
Companies hate giving pay rises to people they are planning to lose.

There is a secondary issue as to why this specialist support requirement is needed in the first place, where in the business is failing that creates this. Fix the source of the problems and they reduce.I can't put specifics, but this really is a niche dept.

I


my replies in red above

spirit

Prothet_of_Doom wrote: »

I like to think of work as a 2 way exploitation.


They exploit you because you are the best they can get at the price they want to pay, and they will pay you as little as you are prepared to accept.


You exploit them, because you are doing the least stressful job, that you are qualified to do, for the BEST terms and conditions you can get at the time (bearing in mind long term carrots, like vague promises of career progression, and a pension)


If you are not getting the best terms and conditions you could, there might be many reasons. a) Unfounded loyalty b) it's convenient, c) you are lazy d) 1001 other reasons. a and b are correct, it used to be a good job with an element of kudos to it, this is less apparent of late.


The point is that HR rules are there to be broken, but you have to go about it the right way.


I'd be talking to recruitment agencies, about your actual value, and be looking to move on. I wouldn't threaten them, just resign, as soon as you get a better offer and when they panic, remind them that you did point out what the going rate for your skills are. Don't tell them what the new offer is. I am about to tout my CV around, just updating it now.


IF they start to make you a better offer, tell them they have only one chance to put it right, and if their offer is double the increase that the new offer would give you accept it. If not tell them you would have stayed for 4 times the increase, but since they continue to insult your intelligence, you'll be working your notice as already tendered. I'd still be looking to leave actually because I no longer trust them. There is also the element of them using me to pass on my knowledge before they get rid of me. I'd rather go of my own accord. I'd even prefer to go now and leave them completely in the lurch.

More comments in red.

skivenov

Marktheshark wrote: »

Apply for the new post.

^ this :cool:

bugslet

spirit wrote: »

. My manager said that the company does not approve of people discussing salary, so she was discounting it.
.

Hmm, there may be things I'm not happy about in my company, but that's different to what people are free to do. Unless there is some clause in your contract that you can't discuss a certain subject, the disapproval is not really that relevant. I presume as well your friend wasn't working for the company, s/he'd been for an interview, so they are free to discuss salary.

Takeaway_Addict wrote: »

There is no legal requirement for pay to be 'fair', it just cannot discriminate against protected characteristics.

Absolutely right Takeaway. But in my company I try to be as fair as possible, we run rotas to make sure the work is distributed as fairly as possible, we pay the same wages for the same work, it just makes sense ( to me ) and I feel that I get a lot back from my staff, there's no atmosphere, there's no resentment. My thoughts on it being fair were subjective, not legal advice:)

C_Mababejive

Golden rule=never volunteer for anything unless there is betterment>£££ involved in it.

PlutoinCapricorn

Spirit, are there no policy & procedures or training guides that newcomers could read?

pmduk

Perhaps the Manager will have to do some training?