Electric car & charging

harveybobbles

£40,000 new for the Outlander PHLEGMY?

How is that saviing money and being green?

gilbert_and_sullivan

I think people are being urged into an expensive lifestyle statement with these vehicles, probably an excellent choice of company car though, someone else is being conned then and the driver gets the benefits.

Personally £40k sees me purchasing enough cars for 30 years of driving, but each to their own.

Charging points are bound to become an issue as they gain popularity, leading no doubt to heated confrontations and another new criminal offence of charging point rage will be created by the EU law makers in due course when the first EV owner gets beaten senseless or worse for hogging the point or pinching 'my' electric.

What these designs are good for is for knocking down the makers average fuel consumptions (as per test figures) to keep them in line with EU targets.

Kim_kim

worried_jim wrote: »

You may want to wait until a better model is introduced-

No problem, because this morning I give you … drum roll … the Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV. Yes, PHEV. Great name. Sounds as if it could be the weapons system on a Klingon Bird of Prey. Or some kind of CIA drone. “Let’s take the PHEV tonight, darling.” Mmmm. I like the sound of that.
To the casual observer it’s a crossover 4×4 urban sports activity school-run mum-mobile just like all the other crossover 4×4 urban sports activity school-run mum-mobiles. But look carefully, because it appears to have two petrol filler caps: one on either side.
Aha. Wrong. You put the petrol in the one on the left and electricity in the one on the right, because, yup, behind the suburban exterior the four-wheel-drive PHEV is pretty much identical to the Porsche 918 Spyder and the BMW i8.

You climb aboard, you select electric power and, as long as the battery is charged, which it will be if you hooked the car up to the mains overnight, you will have enough juice to do about half what Mitsubishi says is possible. That equates to just over 16 miles, and that’s fine if you are going to work or school, but not so fine if you’re going to Darlington — or Stonehenge, as my Sunday Times colleague Eleanor Mills reported in Driving two weeks ago.
No worries, though, because when the battery is flat you simply start the ordinary 2-litre petrol engine and it will take over the driving duties. Or, and this is the clever bit, you can push the “Charge” button, which causes it not only to do the propulsion but to charge the battery at the same time.
So you are using petrol to give you those 16 miles of electric running. And here’s the big question: how much petrol?
Mitsubishi doesn’t say. And it’s impossible to work out without actually being in the engine, and that’s even more impossible. But look at it this way: to cover 16 miles on the engine alone would use about four pints of petrol. Does it take four pints to charge up that battery? Probably.

There is a solution, and that’s to use the process of slowing down to charge up the cells. But if you engage this system, it feels as though you’ve hit a wall every time you lift your foot off the accelerator. It’s good for the planet, I’m sure, but it’s not good for the chap behind, because you are slowing down very rapidly … and your bloody brake lights haven’t come on!
It’s probably best not to worry about the chap behind and to relax in the knowledge that, theoretically, your big school-run-mobile can do 148mpg. That’s not a misprint. It can also do muddy fields, tow a horse box and keep you entertained on a long run with all its many features.
There are some drawbacks, though. And the main one is this. That if you strip away all the clever-clever running gear, the Outlander isn’t a very good car. The ride is poor, the petrol engine is soulless, the styling is dreadful, the seats are hard and the performance is woeful.

http://www.driving.co.uk/car-reviews/the-clarkson-review-mitsubishi-outlander-phev-gx4hs/

Thank you for such an informative response, a bit over my head some of it!
I'm not sure what you mean about using 4 pints to get the 16 miles? I thought the overnight charge gave you your first burst of electric miles?

That 16 miles would actually do me for much of my journeys.
I do that a day - every day.
Once a week I do a 70 mile round trip so by your reckoning - 16 miles there on electric, then 19 miles on petrol. Then charge (with a bit of luck), then 16 miles back & 19 miles on electric?
So 38 miles on petrol?
So about a gallon & a third?

I test drove it, the 4, I thought it drove beautifully, but I know sod all about cars!!

AdrianC

harveybobbles wrote: »

How is that saviing money

Because every time you plug in to a public charging point, somebody else pays for your electricity. It won't last, of course.

and being green?

Probably better not to ask where the electricity comes from.
http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/
Oh, look - 70% fossil at the moment.

arcon5

Iceweasel wrote: »

I wouldn't even think of getting an electric car - on principal.

They are more polluting than a diesel.

Consider the whole effect on the planet.

How and where was the battery produced?

How is the electricity to re-charge it produced?

The whole thing is a con.

And the government know it - but they need to be seen to be doing something.

Doing anything will do - even pulling the wool over our eyes.

Not that i'm in a position to disagree with your comments, but wonder if you have any stats to back this up? Of course it will still contribute to greenhouse gasses in many ways, but I wonder what the footprint is in comparison to a car based on say avg usage.

AdrianC

arcon5 wrote: »

Not that i'm in a position to disagree with your comments, but wonder if you have any stats to back this up? Of course it will still contribute to greenhouse gasses in many ways, but I wonder what the footprint is in comparison to a car based on say avg usage.

Well, let's start with 527g/co2 per kwh
http://www.carbonindependent.org/sources_home_energy.htm
It's a 12kwh battery in the Outlander PHEV. Call it 80% discharged for 16 miles (25km), and that's 9.6kwh, or 5kg of co2 for 25km or 200g/km.

sillygoose

Iceweasel wrote: »

I wouldn't even think of getting an electric car - on principal.

They are more polluting than a diesel.

Consider the whole effect on the planet.

How and where was the battery produced?

How is the electricity to re-charge it produced?

The whole thing is a con.

And the government know it - but they need to be seen to be doing something.

Doing anything will do - even pulling the wool over our eyes.

Getting mine tomorrow :T:T:T

And I don't give a rats bottom about any of the above, what running this car will do to the planet is unimaginably miniscule compared to what the industries in China, India, USA wtc do every day. If they stop so will I!

Meanwhile I will swan around in my big SUV paying £220 a MONTH less tax than most other people in theirs.. and nothing is going to stop me feeling bad about that.

Oh.. and the government are paying £5000 towards my new car as a grant.. thanks!

As to the review copied by worried jim, well selective would describe it. A couple of hatchet jobs presumably to keep their German advertisers happy and widely considered to be utter tosh. The Clarkson one seems to be for another vehicle it so factual incorrect! The Germans are playing catch up on this technology and they don't like that.

Having had one on test for several days I actually ordered one by the end of the first day so unlike Clarkson I have actually driven one for real.

Its a very quiet comfortable, spacious, sure footed vehicle, it rides very well, and I am especially critical in that areas and had discounted several alternatives such as the shockingly uncomfortable Tiguan.

Seats are comfortable and the vehicle is quick (Whatcar found it quicker in the mid range than the diesel automatic BMW X3 and Audi Q5 or XC60) and competitive over other speed benchmarks.

The regenerative braking is nothing like hitting a wall, you can control with paddles on the steering wheel the level of slowing and its ideal for holding your speed steady downhill the same as putting a normal car in a lower gear - no one is going to rear end you

Despite Clarkson, this car is selling like hot potatoes, way outselling all others and taking half the electric car grants.

Also you don't start the engine. The car runs from the battery using electric motors. Generally the engine starts when needed to top up the battery then stops again, or starts quickly and pitches in if you need faster acceleration, then shuts down.

As I said, I am not buying it for the Green bit, I would rather give my hard earned to Mitsubishi for a fantastic car than give it to the government in phoney justification tax for a rubbish car.

sillygoose

harveybobbles wrote: »

£40,000 new for the Outlander PHLEGMY?

How is that saviing money and being green?

£5000 government grant off it. GX4H is £37000 so £32000 after the grant which is paid direct to the dealer.

For a large 4wd with big boot, full leather, heated & electric seats, HID lights, sunroof, sat nav, DAB, reversing camera, electric tailgate, keyless entry, WIFI remote control!!! and so on and so on... with only 5% BIK for company car drivers (most of which don't pay for fuel anyway so don't care about mpg) compared to 22-26% for any other £32K 4wd.

you must see how that is MSE!

Spicy_McHaggis

sillygoose wrote: »

£5000 government grant off it. GX4H is £37000 so £32000 after the grant which is paid direct to the dealer.

For a large 4wd with big boot, full leather, heated & electric seats, HID lights, sunroof, sat nav, DAB, reversing camera, electric tailgate, keyless entry, WIFI remote control!!! and so on and so on... with only 5% BIK for company car drivers (most of which don't pay for fuel anyway so don't care about mpg) compared to 22-26% for any other £32K 4wd.

you must see how that is MSE!

32 grand for an Outlander no way.

It's a converted pick up and handles like an empty one.

sillygoose

Spicy_McHaggis wrote: »

32 grand for an Outlander no way.

It's a converted pick up and handles like an empty one.

That would be the mark 2, which mark 3 have you driven?