Who is responsible for fence repair

Land_Registry

jefner - hold fire on contacting us as I suspect you have all the available information re your own property anyway.

The plans you have added look like the Transfer plan (the one by the developer to the first buyer) and the title plan (ours). The title plan would not refer to the fencing or T marks as mentioned but the developer's can do but not always. As others have mentioned there are no hard and fast rules to this.

The Transfer could still refer to the fencing within it's clauses - have a look for a schedule which refers to covenants as it may say something like they are are all party fences i.e. shared

You could also check your neighbour's title to see if that refers but the odds are, if it's one of the adjoining houses, that they mirror your own so nothing to be gained.

The fact that one house pre-dates the other may have no bearing at all as fences are often used to denote a boundary and/or to keep things in/out.

Our online guidance explains some of the basics around boundaries and how the registered information and other details can come into play for example the neighbour put the fence up last time it blew down or the previous owners told you that you were responsible etc

At the end of the day such information can help inform both neighbours but invariably it's a case of agreeing a way forward between you if you can.

The issues many can face is that either there is no evidence to support who is responsible for what (most properties have no such registered details) but even if there is if the neighbour won't agree or act upon it what next? Pursuing it legally is likely to cost more than repairing it yourself so if you can reach and agreement and formalise it then that might be the easiest/cheapest option here

Mojisola

27col wrote: »

I don't think that there is any requirement for anyone to actually maintain a fence. The only requirement is for them to mark the boundary. A wire stretched between two posts is sufficient.

isotonic_uk wrote: »

I am in the same situation, I have checked on the deeds and because its on the right side, its my neighbours responsbility.

Are you saying they dont legally have to do anything? That worries me as its 2 fence panels, there a huge gap now and its a real eye sore.

In this scenario, if my neighbours were being difficult (i dont expect them tbh) but if they were, would I be able to lodge a complaint to someone after giving them a reasonable time? I am quite desperate to get it sorted as I am in a semi and there house is a detached and they have a side entrance whereas I dont so that fence is a bit of a security risk for me.

You can't usually force a neighbour to repair or maintain a fence.

27col

Mojisola wrote: »

You can't usually force a neighbour to repair or maintain a fence.

My point exactly. Also you can't force them to have a fence in the first place.
There was a woman on here recently complaining that, because her neighbour had not repaired a fence, her dogs were getting loose. No sign there of her taking responsibility for the security of her dogs.

Mojisola

27col wrote: »

My point exactly. Also you can't force them to have a fence in the first place.

I included your post because it answered isotonic's question.

It usually comes down to the person who is most irritated by the broken fence who pays for a new one.

Our deeds say that we must maintain stock-proof fences of a certain height but, if we didn't, I can't imagine the neighbours would be able to take legal action against us.

societys_child

Mojisola wrote: »

You can't usually force a neighbour to repair or maintain a fence.

Agreed!:cool:

Also, the op should note that if there's a "t" on any title plans, it only denotes who is responsible for the boundary, but not necessarily the fence, which could have been erected by the neighbour at some point in the past. The only way to know is to talk to the neighbours . . .

Land_Registry

societys_child wrote: »

Agreed!:cool:

Also, the op should note that if there's a "t" on any title plans, it only denotes who is responsible for the boundary, but not necessarily the fence, which could have been erected by the neighbour at some point in the past. The only way to know is to talk to the neighbours . . .

That may be true in some cases but it is important to read and understand the registered information and any other relevant details as well.

T marks are very unlikely to appear on a title plan but may appear on a deed plan or be referred to in a register entry and explained away by a Note to that entry.

T marks alone are just an indicator and it is often important (where they exist) to read the deed wording as well as this will vary from deed to deed and title to title so may well refer to responsibility for the boundary or fence or anything else but the wording is important.

Ultimately, and as stated, such matters are best resolved in discussion with the neighbour.

However that is not always possible, hence numerous threads re boundaries and fences, so it is important to understand what may be relevant and how differing views can be arrived at over time.

For example a covenant to maintain a fence/boundary marked with a T made in 1935 may have minimal impact if the next 5 owners over the intervening 80 years all did something quite different.

mojisola rightly steers us away from legal action. Pooling information and understanding can often help each neighbour to appreciate that agreeing who does what etc is the simple way forward. Whether both neighbours can do that and agree though can often depend on other factors of course.

jefner

Land_Registry_representative wrote: »

jefner - hold fire on contacting us as I suspect you have all the available information re your own property anyway.

The pans you have added look like the Transfer plan (the one by the developer to the first buyer) and the title plan (ours). The title plan would not refer to the fencing or T marks as mentioned but the developer's can do but not always. As others have mentioned there are no hard and fast rules to this.

The Transfer could still refer to the fencing within it's clauses - have a look for a schedule which refers to covenants as it may say something like they are are all party fences i.e. shared


thank you so much for your reply. I have in front of me a Land Registry Charge Certificate. Am I likely to find something in that?

jefner

I have found something in the first schedule (the land and buildings transferred) of the Charge Certificate

"The land or pieces of land edged red and marked number 150 on the plan being part of the development together with the house and all other buildings and erections hereafter erected thereon with the appurtenances thereof and all rights enjoyed therewith and all service installations now or hereafter exclusively serving the same PROVIDED that (i) any part of a wall of the house or garage which also forms part of a building erected or in course of erection on any adjoining part of the development shall be a party wall and any garden fence between the property and any adjoining part of the development shall be a party fence and shall be maintained at the joint and equal expense of the transferee and the registered proprietor from time to time of such adjoining buildings and land......blah blah blah!!!!

Land_Registry

Yes - that is in essence a copy of the register/title plan and deed(s) as held by us

Just read the register and deed carefully to understand what it contains and it's meaning.

Thereafter it is a question of sharing/pooling that information with your neighbour along with the guidance around boundaries and coming to an agreement.

jefner

then it goes on to say in the Party Services & Structures section

"To pay a fair and proper proportion of the expenses from time to time of inspecting repairing maintaining reinstating and (where applicable) cleaning any service installations" blah blah blah...... and then it says "To join with the registered proprietors for the time being of the premises adjoining the property in repairing maintaining and if necessary reinstating the party walls and fences referred to in the First Schedule" which I detailed above