Salmond and Sturgeon Want the English Fish for More Fat Subsidies

wotsthat

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Those are the results of a not to be taken too seriously poll which also included Morgan Freeman and Judi Dench. You claim that there is loads of widespread positive coverage for the SNP in the media, and that I simply have a chip on my shoulder. I only asked where your evidence of this positive media coverage was.

You've got me lolling now. Sturgeon is named greatest living Scot which is widely covered and you're complaining about negative media. You picked exactly the wrong day to continue with the 'they all hate us' mantra and hope to look credible.

Shakethedisease

wotsthat wrote: »

You've got me lolling now. Sturgeon is named greatest living Scot which is widely covered and you're complaining about negative media. You picked exactly the wrong day to continue with the 'they all hate us' mantra and hope to look credible.

It' was me that posted the Yougov poll ? I apologise if you think that it's 100% concrete proof of positive SNP coverage. I didn't actually intend that anyone would take it very seriously as some sort of media endorsement of SNP policy. Salmond was in the top 5 too after all.

.string.

That Poll >>

I'm not that surprised in today's Scottish political climate where all the little natlanders will vote for the top SNP politicians, whether they be Saints or Frogs to the exclusion of anyone else.

Naturally the Scots who are not part of the SNP collective will vote for any of a range of candidates.

I agree with Shakey - don't take it seriously.

wotsthat

Shakethedisease wrote: »

It' was me that posted the Yougov poll ? I apologise if you think that it's 100% concrete proof of positive SNP coverage. I didn't actually intend that anyone would take it very seriously as some sort of media endorsement of SNP policy. Salmond was in the top 5 too after all.

It was good enough proof for you to disprove someone's article saying things were going South for Nicola but not good enough to hint at positive media for the SNP?

Go figure.

wotsthat

.string. wrote: »

That Poll >>

I'm not that surprised in today's Scottish political climate where all the little natlanders will vote for the top SNP politicians, whether they be Saints or Frogs to the exclusion of anyone else.

Naturally the Scots who are not part of the SNP collective will vote for any of a range of candidates.

I agree with Shakey - don't take it seriously.

Yes, it's just a poll but it wasn't a popularity poll (that was favourable reporting). It's more like a focus group and is really measuring media coverage. The results indicate her message is seen as reasonably positive and lots of people are hearing it. She'll be delighted and her media consultants will be too.

It's at odds with the idea the media are overwhelmingly negative.

skintmacflint

Shakethedisease wrote: »

I guess we'll have to wait until manifesto's are out. But it's a little early imo to start castigating the SNP for 50p tax raises or not until we know either way. Don't you think ?

Not exactly sure how a single question and general observation which I said applied to both Labour and SNP , becomes 'castigation of SNP' only, in any shape or form. Must be one one of these Nat things.

I notice Yes leaning Iain McWhirter political correspondent is under fire on Twitter from some Nats for commenting that Scottish Labour had rediscovered it's soul, and not having full control of tax powers shouldn't mean not using the powers you have.

To the extent he has tweeted ' There is a well of paranoia among SNP twitter anti. Too many regard disagreement as betrayal.

Welcome to the new Scotland. It's just braw.

Shakethedisease

skintmacflint wrote: »

Not exactly sure how a single question and general observation which I said applied to both Labour and SNP , becomes 'castigation of SNP' only, in any shape or form. Must be one one of these Nat things.

Nothing like 'broad brushing' people into boxes is there. I can't be bothered going round in circles again apart from to say, that you're good at castigating.

I notice Yes leaning Iain McWhirter political correspondent is under fire on Twitter from some Nats for commenting that Scottish Labour had rediscovered it's soul, and not having full control of tax powers shouldn't mean not using the powers you have.

To the extent he has tweeted ' There is a well of paranoia among SNP twitter anti. Too many regard disagreement as betrayal.

Welcome to the new Scotland. It's just braw.

You think Twitter is 'real life' ? Time to log off :eek:

McWhirter is a federalist, who makes no secret of the fact he voted Labour for many years ( his old pre 2011 opinion pieces are very good but definitely Labour leaning, like most of the Scottish commentary at the time ).
I like him. As I do Kevin McKenna, Alex Massie and even David Torrance. But when they opinion facts, that aren't actually facts.. then they should fully expect to be called out on them through whatever medium they write them. They do the same to others for a living after all.

McWhirter is uninformed on tax credits, and he's written many, many times over the Tory 'fiscal trap' of income tax powers and bemoaning the fact that the SNP are about to 'walk right into it'. He also is mistaken over what Scottish Labour can and cannot lawfully include in their 2016 manifesto. Since they aren't legally registered as a separate party to UK Labour ( they're one and the same re the electoral commission ). He wasn't overly impressed on being informed he was wrong and called out on it. That's life. On Twitter anyway.

Generali

Shakethedisease wrote: »

He also is mistaken over what Scottish Labour can and cannot lawfully include in their 2016 manifesto. Since they aren't legally registered as a separate party to UK Labour ( they're one and the same re the electoral commission )

Labour really need to sort out how Scottish Labour is going to relate to rUK Labour with respect to policy promises. At present there are two completely separate and opposed policies to Trident and to welfare too it would seem with Scottish Labour saying that they support one thing and England and Wales Labour saying that they support another.

How the heck can you vote in a General Election for Labour on that basis unless they are genuinely going to split into two parties? What exactly am I getting on Trident? Does it depend on whether I'm North or South of the border and so my representative will vote in line with local policy or something else perhaps like the individual preferences of the MP or which side of the bed Mr Corbyn got out on that morning?

What about collective cabinet responsibility, how does that work?

Remember, this isn't about coalition Government. If you vote SNP or for most parties contesting a general election then you know full well that they can't form a majority Government as they aren't contesting a majority of seats! Even the most ardent supporter of the Something New party or the Guildford Green Belt Group would understand that a coalition would push through parts of their program but they would have to compromise on other parts.

If you vote Labour however, there is a serious [STRIKE]risk[/STRIKE] chance that they will win. How can you do that if you have no idea what you are voting for?

skintmacflint

Shakethedisease wrote: »

You think Twitter is 'real life' ? Time to log off :eek:

From the blog by Dan Vevers, Generali kindly provided the correct link to on my behalf

' people argue that social media doesn't constitute reality. Of course it does, it's people who use it. Indeed as a conduit for allowing people to say what they really think It arguably provides more insight than debating with strangers in a pub.

Are people so certain , that the unpleasant febrile atmosphere that can easily be discovered within the pro-independence networks on line, does not , or won't manifest itself on the streets or in real life'

I rest my case, courtesy to young Dan.

skintmacflint

Shakethedisease wrote: »

McWhirter is uninformed on tax credits, and he's written many, many times over the Tory 'fiscal trap' of income tax powers and bemoaning the fact that the SNP are about to 'walk right into it'. He also is mistaken over what Scottish Labour can and cannot lawfully include in their 2016 manifesto. Since they aren't legally registered as a separate party to UK Labour ( they're one and the same re the electoral commission ). He wasn't overly impressed on being informed he was wrong and called out on it. That's life. On Twitter anyway.

McWhirter simply asked the point of asking for more powers if a devolved Scottish government won't use the powers it already has, and is due to get. On what he obviously thinks is an important issue.

As far as I am aware, it could be complex with possibly requiring high cost systems and admin required. The question remains whether a devolved SG feels the effect versus the cost is important enough .

Maybe Scotland needs to be asked if it feels tax credit loss and associated cost to offset , is more important than receiving some of the current extras Scotland currently enjoys. Or whether extra tax should be raised?

Ian Murray Labour was pretty clear he didn't care how these tax credits were offset, as long as it was achieved. Be that via Osbourne, or the existing Scottish government. Don't imagine anyone affected by them will be either. I'm guessing some form of agreement has been reached with Corbyn on what goes into a Scottish labour manifesto.

If still needed that is. Until the Autumn statement it's all pretty hypothetical as Murray said. He also accepted it might not even be necessary. Otherwise he is finished. Seems more than high risk if he's wrong.

The Scottish Labour conference managed despite all odds according to Brian Taylor to have the most authentic energetic debate on various subjects , he's seen since SNP discussed the issue of joining NATO.

Regardless of my opinion of Labour in recent years , I don't begrudge them that.