Salmond and Sturgeon Want the English Fish for More Fat Subsidies

CLAPTON

if scotland was independent today, we can be sure that they would not be pouring money into steel making.

elantan

.string. wrote: »

Whinge of the week

Uncompetitive steel plants are a Tory Plot aimed at Scotland.

I've not heard that one tbh ... I have heard a lot of sympathy for Redcar and Scunthorpe ... and a recognition that England have been hit really hard... have heard a lot of unionists moaning about the SG and the Forth road bridge steel ... but that just makes me yawn

Shakethedisease

skintmacflint wrote: »

Except Independence won't be the opportunity to wipe the slate clean for other parties, or new parties to gain ground and start again will it? As SNP will be in power for at least a decade if not longer. So it would be SNP way all the way.

Forever. Don't be daft. Independence isn't about one political party. However, as it stands only one political party has the means to provide it through the ballot box. You shouldn't confuse the two.

You've just stated Labour were guaranteed seats for around 40 years up here, so SNP will get a nice run too, followed by your assertion half the voters don't trust any of the other parties anymore, but trust SNP and like their policies.

So which is it?

As long as Scotland remains in the union. SNP support is likely to stay high for a number of years. Independence means a clean slate for all parties, even the Tories. With all the full powers a normal government has, focus will shift on how best to use them. There will be many competing views and policies put forward for the public to consider and vote on. Even within the SNP there is likely to be dissent between the left and right of the party and that's where the problems are likely to start for the SNP.

At the moment, within the union the SNP have a common purpose. And yes, half the voters in Scotland right now don't want the Tories, Labour or the Lib Dems anywhere near power in Holyrood. They trust the other parties far less than the SNP.

Do you trust these parties to tell the truth? (net ratings): SNP -5, Labour -42, Conservatives -50, Lib Dem -56. https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/mr8k4ikbr3/TimesResults_October15_ScotlandVI,tax,parties_w.pdf …

elantan

This is true ... whilst the Yes voters I know don't trust Nicola ... they really can't stand the rest ... and wouldn't trust them if their life depended on it

skintmacflint

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Forever. Don't be daft. Independence isn't about one political party. However, as it stands only one political party has the means to provide it through the ballot box. You shouldn't confuse the two.

.

And you shouldn't confuse '10 years or longer 'with 'forever 'either.

It will take time for new and what you call slate clean parties to evolve, gain trust and gather funding and support.

Shakethedisease

skintmacflint wrote: »

And you shouldn't confuse '10 years or longer 'with 'forever 'either.

It will take time for new and what you call slate clean parties to evolve, gain trust and gather funding and support.

No you were confusing my saying that the SNP had 'time yet' when I pointed out how long it had taken for Labour to be dislodged within the Union.. with a completely unknown and new political scenario altogether should independence occur.

They're two very different things. As things stand, I think the SNP has time on their side in terms of winning another election, and a possible referendum 2 contained within their mandate.

Happygreen

.string. wrote: »

Whinge of the week

Uncompetitive steel plants are a Tory Plot aimed at Scotland.

selling England by the pound, nothing's changed...
BY uncompetitive you mean that quality doesn't count because cheap and cheerful is what sells? You know that as a consumer I'd rather buy let's say - as an example - a tool that lasts and pay more for it than the Chinese cheap alloys. But screwdrivers that bend is all we can even get these days.
For everyone's safety I hope their nuclear power stations are not made from their own crap materials they've been selling us but from British steel...

Giving the power over a huge part of our energy production (and having to keep the mouth shut on human rights) into the hands of the Chinese for Billions and cutting renewables is definitely a finger up to Scotland. Where the money flows and where it doesn't says it all.

skintmacflint

Shakethedisease wrote: »

No you were confusing my saying that the SNP had 'time yet' when I pointed out how long it had taken for Labour to be dislodged within the Union.. with a completely unknown and new political scenario altogether should independence occur.

They're two very different things. As things stand, I think the SNP has time on their side in terms of winning another election, and a possible referendum 2 contained within their mandate.

Nope, when I get confused my missus soon tells me. And she is never wrong.

I see a link, you don't. It took 40 years, to oust Labour up here. I think SNP will be the 'better the devil you know party ' up here for thousands of newly converted voters for at least a decade or longer, if Independence was won.

However as Noddy Head seems to have bottled it, doesnt really matter. Seems I could be right when I suggested this wee matter won't be resolved till I'm in the afterlife.

Which cold winters or not, hopefully won't be for several years, thanks to my now extremely cheap to run oil boiler.

skintmacflint

Happygreen wrote: »

selling England by the pound, nothing's changed...
BY uncompetitive you mean that quality doesn't count because cheap and cheerful is what sells? You know that as a consumer I'd rather buy let's say - as an example - a tool that lasts and pay more for it than the Chinese cheap alloys. But screwdrivers that bend is all we can even get these days.
For everyone's safety I hope their nuclear power stations are not made from their own crap materials they've been selling us but from British steel...

Giving the power over a huge part of our energy production (and having to keep the mouth shut on human rights) into the hands of the Chinese for Billions and cutting renewables is definitely a finger up to Scotland. Where the money flows and where it doesn't says it all.

This post IMO started well enough, but lost any credibility as soon as you uttered ' is definitely a finger up to Scotland'.

.string.

skintmacflint wrote: »

This post IMO started well enough, but lost any credibility as soon as you uttered ' is definitely a finger up to Scotland'.

Yes, I wondered how a link between the Steel Plant problems and insults to Scotland would be contrived. The post was quite extraordinary in that respect; one irrelevant point following another.

My use of the word "uncompetitive" is of course challenging and I knew it when I wrote it, but it goes to the heart of the Government's (any Government) dilemma, whether to support a company that cannot trade at a profit or to let it go and how best to support sustainably the people that work there. Whether the market is fair or not is of concern, but it's background and not the main issue unless one is actually in a position to do something about it.

But my main point was simply to anticipate one more in a growing collection of Whinges, and it didn't take long.

I wait for the next manufactured grudge to manifest itself.