Salmond and Sturgeon Want the English Fish for More Fat Subsidies

Shakethedisease

kabayiri wrote: »

How puzzling then that a bunch of Manchester councils have managed to support the development of Manchester airport into a truly international airport.

It is possible to support the growth of local business and skills without complete devolution.

I suspect you will be happier giving excuses as to why the SNP can't achieve things. That is so negative.

No that's not what I'm saying. The SNP have managed perfectly well running their home grown devolved area's withing the constraints of the money they are allocated for it. Investments etc are all there. They do okay with what they have. ( hence the polls ).

It's that you keep calling on them to 'show' the rest of the UK what they can do economically and turn itself into some sort of powerhouse with their 'current powers'... which aren't enough to make a difference, certainly not with austerity max, and cuts coming down the line.. and most of any which may make a difference.. aren't coming into force until next year. There's nothing negative to be said from the facts at hand. Swinney just doesn't have anywhere near the options Osborne has. End of.

Which powers do you personally recommend they use currently will make Scotland's economy streak ahead of the UK wide economy ?

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

Worse than that, they have cut real health spending year on year. Worse still, once you take into account expensive gimmicks like free parking at hospitals and free prescriptions the amount of money being spent on actually curing the sick is falling even faster.

Vote SNP: Vote Death. Not so catchy.

Really ??? And you think free car parking at hospitals is an 'expensive gimmick' ? Tell that to those that work there, or low income families staying with sick children on the wards. Or pensioners visiting friends for weeks on end.

9 October 2014The budget for NHS Scotland is to rise by £288m to over £12bn, Finance Secretary John Swinney has said.
The announcement was part of a package of funding measures set out by Mr Swinney in his budget statement to MSPs.
He also announced funding for infrastructure, schools, housing and energy efficiency...


...He added: "This budget continues our actions to mitigate UK government welfare cuts with £81m of support and delivers on our commitments to expand childcare and to provide free school meals for all P1-P3 pupils.
"And we will secure the future of the health service in public hands, with extra funding in 2015-16 bringing the total health budget to more than £12bn for the first time."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-29558989

Shakethedisease

elantan wrote: »

Hey Shake good to see you back, hope you had fun

We all had a fabulous time thanks ! Weather was glorious too. :beer:

Shakethedisease

zagubov wrote: »

We've gone in a big circle here. Loads of people on this thread seem to think that Scots fit into two categories.
55% are too poor to live without subsidies and voted NO.
45% are too stupid to see through SNP lies and voted YES.
I suspect they think the non-voters were too wee to reach the ballot box.

That could be me.. I'm only 5ft on a good day. Thank goodness for platform heels.

Generali

Shakethedisease wrote: »

We all had a fabulous time thanks ! Weather was glorious too. :beer:

I'm very happy for you.

What do you think about Sturgeon lying about whether the SNP would vote on fox hunting?

ruggedtoast

I want Nicola Sturgeon to do something else to upset the Conservatives. It has been two days now since the last time and I am getting withdrawal.

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

I'm very happy for you.

What do you think about Sturgeon lying about whether the SNP would vote on fox hunting?

Mixed feelings on that overall, but can see why she/SNP did it. I was the same as elantan when I heard they were thinking about it. However, the fact the SNP haven't voted on English only issues for the last 20 years or so, isn't written in stone. Having to sit back and watch English MP's vote down every single amendment put forward by Scottish MP's ( by the SNP and the Labour MP ).. on the Scotland Bill over the last few weeks, on the pretext that it's a UK parliament and 'that's how things work' and 'Scotland voted No' for this so shut it. Can't have been easy. Was a good reminder that the UK parliament for now is just that. UK wide with UK MP's. Something which the Tories have been only too happy to remind the SNP of, again and again, over the last few weeks.. That narrative cuts both ways however. A little reminder of that too.

There were also significant calls from many SNP supporters, as well as Labour directly for the SNP to vote with them against the government.

The Tories were either hoping for the SNP to abstain in order to pass it. Or flushing the SNP out to vote so that EVEL could be beefed up. There was a reason the EVEL debate was scheduled immediately after. Labour were hoping to make the SNP look bad in Scotland to their own supporters which is why they made such a song and dance up here in newspapers asking the SNP to vote with them.

Damned if they did, damned they didn't. Threatening to vote was the lesser of the two evils imo. And at the end of the day, it was Cameron not being sure of his own MP's that allowed events to unfold as they did. It's not like the SNP have anything much to lose in terms of positive publicity in the media anyway. This fox hunting issue could possibly have lost them votes however at the ballot box next May if they had abstained. They wouldn't have lost many if they had voted instead. In the end, they didn't even need to do that.

And lo and behold.. this appeared in Scottish newspapers today... I'll believe it when I see it, but I wonder what has prompted such a shift over this...

Ministers make major concession on extra powers for Scotland

Major concessions on extra powers for the Scottish Parliament will be unveiled in the autumn, David Cameron’s government has signalled. Scottish Secretary David Mundell said that ministers would put "substantive" changes before MPs.

The Conservative government has previously insisted that the Scotland Bill going through Westminster implements the Smith Commission proposals on greater devolution in full.

..Ministers refused to give any details on what powers would be beefed up but one government source said that the changes would be "more than mere drafting fixes".
Another said that they would include a "softening of the language around vetoes" over welfare...

...Pressed on the issue Mr Mundell said: "It is my intention to make substantive amendments in the House of Commons when the Bill comes back."
He added that he was reflecting on "serious" and "constructive" amendments brought forward by the SNP and Labour that had been rejected by the Government.

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/13421745.Ministers_make_major_concession_on_extra_powers_for_Scotland/

ps Beefing up EVEL ( if it is possible, Labour/Lib Dems and some Tory MP's are vehemently against the way it's been introduced too), is good for the SNP. As it further distances Scottish MP's in future from Westminster. The SNP aren't against EVEL, just the way it's being put through parliament without much debate. But it's hard to see how EVEL can go much further without introducing the UK to some further means of separation between the nations.

wotsthat

i.e. lying is fine as long as it's the SNP doing it.

.string.

Shakethedisease wrote: »

What, all of them ? All stupid enough to be 'deceived'. And that's your considered opinion on the voting patterns of the Scots electorate over the last 8 years is it ? Because if it is, it's a pretty awful and slightly insulting explanation.

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/poll-snp-poised-for-historic-third-holyrood-term-1-3832347

I think you might be deceiving yourself somewhat.

It is my considered opinion of the SNP and their lack of honesty, always trying to spin off events and discussions into anything but facing the reality of their own faults and intolerant of any political opinion but their own.

But then I'm not in thrall to any political party.

.string.

Re the Fox business, I would guess that the Scottish Parliament does not have free votes, since your remarks indicate a certain lack of awareness of what that means. One thing that affair did illustrate was the artificial use of the Fox business to highlight faux arguments on a totally different subject. The sooner this EVEL thing is sorted the better. The whole thing was becoming a circus and it made sense to postpone it until EVEL was sorted and a proper debate could take place.

I would not expect too much change in the devolution powers, Shakey, the SNP amendments were daft, and not acceptable. See Tomkins blog for that.

P.S. - it is a UK Parliament.