Trials of living in a block of flats

AliceBanned

beecher2 wrote: »

What an odd post. As PN says, not everyone can afford a house, and in many urban areas flats make up the majority of the housing stock. Also, it is living in flats which can make many people noise intolerant - noise didn't ever bother me until a drug addict moved into the flat above me and it made my life miserable. I dont' think people understand the impact unless they've dealt with it themselves.

Very true. This is the culmination of very bad experiences in the past, where it got so bad that Shelter intervened and took my landlord to court!! It has to get pretty bad for them to have the resources to help.

So you are right, it isn't quite a simple as duchy might think. Sometimes it's a near-lifetime of extremely down and out neighbours and it is the people who put up with it who suffer and get worn down. I'm ok for now though, decided it is annoying but reasonable noise and won't get irritated. .

AliceBanned

Hi

Thought I would report back as there has been a change.

The situation rumbled on; I was sort of putting up with an unhappy situation. Then last Saturday morning I was awoken at 4am. They were going about their business of getting ready for work etc as they do (noisily) and this went on until 5am. As it was Saturday in particular, this time I left a note outside their flat. I think I fired with both barrells, but without being rude.

Basically said this is not on, it is the weekend and I have now been woken by them most weekends (during the week at least I am up early myself, though not as early as them). I ask them to please take care not to stamp loudly as they walk and not keep allowing doors to slam. The front door to the block shouldn't be slammed, and at 5am when they left, it is really just inconsiderate. I have heard nothing. They have quietened down a lot - showing that they are capable of walking without stamping etc. Some people just need to be told they are causing a problem, and as it was so early on a Saturday morning I felt well within my rights to start trying to sort it out. Hopefully this will be the last of it.

I think they are renting on a short contract so they are probably worried that they could get thrown out. Whatever the reason, they've learnt to be better neighbours and I'm not so stressed. I will see how it goes this Saturday. They seem to work 7 days between the two of them (I see them leave together most days, but hear one of them come back at the weekend). It means for me I don't have a break from them in the mornings. to be fair they could be worse, but I really thought Saturday was taking the p£ss and I shouldn't be too easy on them when they do things like that. Most people have a sense in the early hours, just a sense, of those around them not being up and about.:(

freeisgood

I am glad you have a bit of good news.
But you know, as you have bought the place I am wondering if you should invest in some sound proofing of your ceiling. I think there is is stuff they can put up professionally, and it creates a new ceiling. It would give you piece of mind for the future.

PS as for the slamming main door.....we had a clever solution for the main door in the block of flats we lived in. I just stuck a couple of small pieces of foam rubber (you can also use the sort to buy for doors) at key points along the frame and the door shut fine, but got rid of the slam.

AliceBanned

freeisgood wrote: »

I am glad you have a bit of good news.
But you know, as you have bought the place I am wondering if you should invest in some sound proofing of your ceiling. I think there is is stuff they can put up professionally, and it creates a new ceiling. It would give you piece of mind for the future.

PS as for the slamming main door.....we had a clever solution for the main door in the block of flats we lived in. I just stuck a couple of small pieces of foam rubber (you can also use the sort to buy for doors) at key points along the frame and the door shut fine, but got rid of the slam.

Thanks. I had no idea you could get it for the ceiling. I have read that sound proofing in flats makes a big difference though. At the moment I have no extra funds but perhaps I will look into it in a year or two.:)

It is part of the door's design - I realised that it does make a slamming noise of its own accord so perhaps shouldn't have had a go at them about that. Never mind, if I didn't notice a difference after the note, then it wouldn't be confirmed that they had been making more noise than was necessary.

I think I know the foam stuff you mean - like the sort used to exclude draughts?

Roger_Mellie_2

Glad to read that you're making progress. I can, however, sympathise with you.

I live in a block of maisonettes which consists of 4 properties. Since moving in, I've always been able to hear a TV and also a barking dog. The barking dog was easily identifiable as belonging to the elderly gentlemen in the ground floor maisonette across from me, but the loud TV was a mystery.

For about a year I was hung up on this noise which seemed to come from below me. After a few months I decided to have a word with the lady below who apologised profusely to me. It wasn't until I said to her "when you have your TV on at 2am in your bedroom the noise comes straight up to me". She replied with "I don't have a TV in my bedroom?". After further discussions, she then started to moan at me about the maisonette next door to her and the volume of his TV: the old gent with the dog. To cut a long story short, the racket had been coming from him because a) he was deaf, b) didn't like wearing a hearing aid and c) had been using his TV full blast volume wise with no complaints.

I narrowed down how the sound travelled in that my floor (the ground floor resident's ceiling) has an empty 3 inch cavity between the ceiling and my floor boards. When this guy watched his TV with the volume at full blast the sound simply travelled along his cavity, to the party wall, through the joists and then into the cavity below me. During this time, I noticed the sound from this old gent's TV was louder in my bathroom and the neighbour below me also mentioned the same thing with regards to her bathroom which is directly below mine. The bathroom is quite a distance from the source of the sound but the floors in the bathroom and kitchen are made from concrete which seemed to amplify what was being transmitted through the cavity I mentioned above. It seemed that as soon as the sound hit the concrete it was then passed out of the material far quicker than floorboards, underlay and carpet.

On talking to sound insulation firms, they advised that one solution may be to put rockwool acoustic insulation into the cavities, particularly by the party wall. Not much money, but a lot of effort in getting up the floorboards.

In the end, and after being kept up till 4am with this gent's TV, I decided to confront him about it. Initially he said stuff like "you must have real sensitive hearing" and "yeah, I'll make a note of it". I also noted that his property was furnished with laminate flooring meaning there was nothing in his property to absorb the sound.

In the end, and after many knocks on his door, he has purchased wireless headphones for all his TVs. Every now and again he does have the TV really loud but I'm straight to his door to ask him to turn it down. 3 weeks ago he invited me in to 'hear for myself' which I didn't need to as I could hear the TV from his front door when closed. Anyway, he has a 50 inch Samsung TV and can only hear it when at full volume, I even noted his dog had it's paws over her ears! I told him that such a volume bleeds into the neighbouring properties and he seemed to take that on board.

Things are a lot quieter now, especially for my neighbour directly below me who shares a party wall with the old gent. I think that 'saying something' is the correct way forward. Before I lived here, I lived in a flat where the neighbour's below would have full band practice in their lounge? When I complained to them I was told "the previous guy who lived above enjoyed our music?" and then the truth came out with "yeah well we just push it to see how far we can get, so far no-one has complained". Fair play in that they did knock it on the head OR knocked on my door just to ask if they could have a practice because "we missed our slot at the hall" etc. However, my point is that a lot of people will just 'push it' whilst a lot of people will suffer in silence (pardon the pun).

I know the difference between reasonable and unreasonable. I don't want to take things to a higher authority and would rather let people know that they are being a tad too loud.

Flats and maisonettes are one big compromise BUT we are all entitled to a reasonable amount of peace and quiet. What is reasonable is determined by the limits of the building's construction fabric, most are pretty poor BUT we have to work within those limits.

I know that I cannot play my drums here, so play them at a dedicated facility. I know that I cannot have a Cinema system for my TV so make do with the volume low or I use my headphones, particularly with my Xbox. I'd love to have laminate flooring but I know that the impact noise would negatively impact my neighbour below. So all of those 'wants' are deferred until I move into a detached house - apart from the drums of course, unless I win the lottery and get somewhere in the middle of nowhere LOL.

I'm still unhappy with this gent's barking dog BUT I've made progress on another front so am willing to just put up with the dog, well...it's not her fault so I'll rephrase that: I am willing to put up with the owner.

So a big 'well done' for talking to your neighbour. I hope things continue to return to normal for you.

freeisgood

Yes Alice, that sort of stuff. There is always a part of the door that hits the frame, and that is where I stuck the bits ( about 2 cm squares of foam.) worked a treat.

freeisgood

Roger I feel your pain, we live with a deaf old lady (my mother)! TV blaring all day, radio on all night (thank goodness only classical) I sleep with earplugs.

As she has dementia, she won't accept there is a problem.

Oh well!

Roger_Mellie_2

freeisgood wrote: »

I am wondering if you should invest in some sound proofing of your ceiling. I think there is is stuff they can put up professionally, and it creates a new ceiling. It would give you piece of mind for the future.

The problem with sound is it's like water, it'll seep through and will highlight the weakness of the building whenever someone goes over the limits of what the fabric can absorb.

False ceilings can cut down the db but then again the sound maybe travelling through the walls. Things can get pricey when it comes to sound absorption techniques and noticeable inches of space can be lost for very little in results.

False ceilings are usually quite good for poorly converted houses into flats where the developer didn't bother to 'sound insulate' what is a simple floor ceiling arrangement designed for a house.

Also, I believe the OP is in shared ownership? The OP would probably need to obtain permission from the HA before carrying out such works.

The OP mentioned washing machines late at night? Are the properties using Economy 7 electric?

Roger_Mellie_2

duchy wrote: »

I do wonder why people who are noise intolerant move into flats .
I grew up in a house ....

Although unintentional, you nailed it right there.

Most folk grew up in a house, formed noise related habits with some (not all) carrying on those habits but in flats. Some folk had parents who did not allow them not to make a racket, whereas others were allowed to make whatever racket they wanted, they lived in a house so who would care?

Mix all those type of folk into an apartment block, you then have a lottery when it comes to noise.

The building fabric of a lot of blocks is nothing short of terrible, for some it is literally plasterboard which separates them from their neighbours. However, and regardless of construction, some folk are just way too loud when it comes to their day-to-day living.

Shelldean

Living in house doesn't always solve the problem.
Lived here over 17 yrs, same neighbour for first 15yrs, no real problems, heard things occasionally. Mother and four sons, so hardly a quiet household.
New neighbours move in and suddenly we hear doors, footsteps, voices, tvs all of which we never hear before. So I doubt it's the sound proofing as if it was we would've heard the first family more often. we also rarely hear the other side who have their two young grandsons staying often.
Just a noisy ignorant bloke and his two daughters pre teen. (he doesn't believe he makes any noise, despite the fact I could name his daughters w/o ever being introduced and name their fav computer game-identified by the sounds)


if anything out of the three families my current noisy neighbour should be the quietest, and is in fact so noisy my neighbour the other side of me has complained!!!


So being in house doesn't always solve the problem unless it's detached!!!!!