Another public sector pay outrage

chewmylegoff

ukcarper wrote: »

If somebody in private industries gets promoted they get a pay rise.

correct. this is a bit like what happens when someone gets promoted in the NHS. by a "bit like" i mean, exactly the same.

chewmylegoff

ukcarper wrote: »

I believe the maximum salary for a nurse is £28k is that really a high salary after 8 years in what is now a degree level job.

the maximum salary for a nurse appears to actually be about £67,000 according to the NHS's website. obviously that is in a management job, but in most careers if you want to be paid more you have to go into management.

Heyhosilver

Generali wrote: »

The MOD employs more pen pushers (mouse pushers these days? ) than fighting people. Crazy.

Well if you accept that a job needs doing, which is best: employing say a Petty Officer to do the admin job after undergoing lots of expensive training in their specialism (costing circa £250K) or employing an administrator on a lower salary who has sufficient skills to do the job and needs much less training?


Would a retail bank employ a qualified accountant to be a financial advisor?


Its quite absurd to call all civilian staff pen pushers. Some are professional engineers, scientists, statisticians, commercial and finance specialists and the like.

ukcarper

chewmylegoff wrote: »

the maximum salary for a nurse appears to actually be about £67,000 according to the NHS's website. obviously that is in a management job, but in most careers if you want to be paid more you have to go into management.

The maximum pay for a nurse who does not get further promotion is £28k what is the pay for managers in private sector.

Spirit_2

michaels wrote: »

Median public sector pay is only 35% higher than median private sector pay (before considering the extra holidays or the gold plated pensions)

50% of workers will get 'scale increments' of circa 3%

There is no money to fund NHS increases with the budget frozen in real terms (and don't forget there is still a 100bn deficit each year so borrowing more is not an option) so any increases in pay means fewer operations.

In the run up to the election of course the nation will be blackmailed with strike threats.

If the low cost/ non healthcare jobs had not been outsourced the workforce profile would be very different.

The incremental scales if operated properly are cost neutral as attrition balances the costs, higher cost leavers replaced by lower paid new recruits (in theory). Starting salaries are 'low' however designed as broad bands.

NHS incremental scales provide longer career horizons including slow pay progression for retaining qualified professionals. When I hear achievements in science A levels and then degrees I usually think that for their financial future I hope they do not fancy a career as a healthcare scientist. My Anaesthetist pal has just persuaded his Science Grad son away from this route to industry.

In higher cost locations staffing will become an increasing constraint on services as nurses, Theatre staff and others cannot afford to live in/relocate to those communities. There is major international recruitment going on now - where recruits are prepared to live in HMO.

A regional component would have made more sense. The NHS has been through this cycle in the last 15 years and resorted to key worker housing previously.

I think this is a thoroughly undignified pay round, badly handled and makes a nonsense of the PRB.

Better to have had no rise for any staff rather than those already at the highest point in the band with a blackmailer approach for future years. What kind of reaction were they expecting from trade unions.

Thrugelmir

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Public sector workers do the most important jobs. Many people in the private sector pack punnets or work for WH Smith.

You are not comparing like with like.

But the private sector has to pay for it......

I'm alright jack is the UK culture today.

chewmylegoff

ukcarper wrote: »

The maximum pay for a nurse who does not get further promotion is £28k what is the pay for managers in private sector.

i don't really understand your point. people who never get promoted tend not to get much of a pay rise whatever career they are in. police constables who remain police constables for 30 years don't tend to get massive payrises for doing so, nor do audit seniors.

managers in the private sector get paid an enormously wide range of salaries depending on what they are managing. many earn less than nurses who never get promoted.

Spirit_2

chewmylegoff wrote: »

the maximum salary for a nurse appears to actually be about £67,000 according to the NHS's website. obviously that is in a management job, but in most careers if you want to be paid more you have to go into management.

Patient needs dictate that for registered staff in acute care a traditional pyramid structure is required to keep nurses , well, nursing.

Spirit_2

chewmylegoff wrote: »

correct. this is a bit like what happens when someone gets promoted in the NHS. by a "bit like" i mean, exactly the same.

That may not be the case. They are broad pay bands, the job evaluation scheme allows for someone to take on quite a lot of additional responsibility, they may get job title inflation by way of recognition but their payband and pay does not go up.

The same could happen in a private sector role too, however it is designed in to broad band pay systems.

Graham_Devon

Thrugelmir wrote: »

But the private sector has to pay for it......

I'm alright jack is the UK culture today.

I assume you also think public sector workers pay no tax?