Suspended - help please

PHILANTHROPIST

Shazza122 wrote: »

Hi River,

Actually got a letter re appeal yesterday. It's meant to be held a week on Tuesday....my problem is I start a 3 month temp contract on Monday and I don't think I can take a day off so soon into it (as well as losing a days money)!!! Need to think through my options as I have no hope the appeal will get me my job back and I'm aware my ex employer is simply going through the process to protect themselves.

Shazza - if you really do not have the time to attend the appeal on the date and time currently being offered then I understand you appear to have at least two options (see below). Before doing so I have to agree with your cynicism. I may open myself to criticism for saying so, but based on my experience the outcome of your appeal will in all likelihood be a foregone conclusion. That said, you would still be wise to consider the following fair and reasonable options if you have a credible and reasonable explanation (or can come up with one !) re why you are unable to attend the appeal at the time and date proposed by your employer :

1. You can ask for the appeal to be re-arranged to a date and time that is convenient for you. It's good practice for employers to hold an appeal ASAP, but there is no strict legal requirement re the timeframe within which an appeal should be heard ; the employer, and ultimately an employment judge, will consider what's fair and reasonable in the circumstances. Conversely, the employee should take all reasonable attempts to attend. If you re-arrange, even if it's 4-6 weeks down the line, or on occasions even longer (I've known a "reasonable" period of 4 months), then so long as your reasons for doing so are on balance reasonable then personally I don't see a problemo.

2. If you do not attend then the employer is ultimately allowed to make a decision in your absence. In the alternative, you or they may seek to mutually agree on what used to be (or may well still be) called a mutually agreed modified procedure, whereby the employer may be able to receive written and detailed reasons for your grounds of appeal , preferably supported by legal arguments ..i.e not just one line reasons. If apt, that may be a compromise. If both sides agree to do so in writing then IMO that should have a higher legal authority than mere good practice.

On balance I'd do your best to attend, even if the date is way down the line. After all it was you who asked for the appeal. So please attempt to be reasonable. If the employer then elects to be somewhat unreasonable then they may ultimately be held to account. That said, penalties (if any) for not strictly adhering to good practice are usually modest unless there has been a significant breach, and in any event sanctions are only imposed if you ever were to attend an ET full hearing and if you win and the judge decided to award you an uplift (capped at up to 25%- usually 5-10% max) on your compensatory award which if you've already got new work may well be limited as you are rightfully taking steps to mitigate your alleged economic loss(es).

Hope that makes some sense and is not mere legal and/or procedural mumbo jumbo. Queries re most areas of employment law and related good practice are rarely answered by a simple yes or no answer ; that's why I was sad enough to make a career out of it ; lol

FBaby

I am pretty convinced there was more to it as it really didn't make sense as you were telling it. It was a silly thing to do, I supposed depending on how 'sexy' it is, but if there is a policy that prevents viewing/dowloading of some materials on the internet, than surely that could be considered similar depending on the content.

I hope that this doesn't amount to dismissal as noone was exposed to it, I would expect just a warning. I wish you good luck.

RiverStar

FBaby wrote: »

I am pretty convinced there was more to it as it really didn't make sense as you were telling it. It was a silly thing to do, I supposed depending on how 'sexy' it is, but if there is a policy that prevents viewing/dowloading of some materials on the internet, than surely that could be considered similar depending on the content.

I hope that this doesn't amount to dismissal as noone was exposed to it, I would expect just a warning. I wish you good luck.

I know it was silly but no one else was exposed so l do hope too for a warning.

It all started with emails to my partner. The other stuff was brought up yesterday so thats why l didn't include in previous posts.

Kayalana99

This thread really annoys me, I feel for you I do, but why start a thread asking for advice about your company who are 'suspending you because of a couple e-mails to your partner i.e how are you' when you knew full well the real reason?

You've been saying things about your temp manager that shes only doing it to gain points....and these 'stories' you don't have to even admit it....if you are emailing them to yourself or your partner(I really am not bothered who really I will not judge you for having a 'creative mind') you have spent works time writing them - so its not only about a 'few sex emails' its the time you've spent putting into them.... making out like they were blowing smoke out of nothing & making the company look bad for suspending you for no real reason...

Just seems like a waste of everyones time asking for advice without giving us the details....

Good luck anyway, but as they obviously have prove you've sent these emails and have reason for gross misconduct...I'd be getting those CV's out.


Edit: I would of said originally to just be honest(ish) and say you are thinking about writing an exotic novel so sometimes on your break you write emails to yourself so you can edit them later...but since you've had your meeting and I get the impression you denied it even though they will have proof of emails going in and out? I think they will have a good ground to dismiss you if they take it that far.

Shazza122

Philanthropist thank you so much for your advice. I am more than happy to attend the meeting but as I said I can't risk losing this three month contract as we very much need the money it is providing. However I will respond to the letter and ask for it to be postponed. Can I ask for it to be a time outside working hours? Or does it have to be between 9-5?

Kayalana99

Shazza122 wrote: »

Philanthropist thank you so much for your advice. I am more than happy to attend the meeting but as I said I can't risk losing this three month contract as we very much need the money it is providing. However I will respond to the letter and ask for it to be postponed. Can I ask for it to be a time outside working hours? Or does it have to be between 9-5?

I didn't read all what Phil said but I am betting it will have to be in there working hours if thats 9-5.

PHILANTHROPIST

Shazza122 wrote: »

Philanthropist thank you so much for your advice. I am more than happy to attend the meeting but as I said I can't risk losing this three month contract as we very much need the money it is providing. However I will respond to the letter and ask for it to be postponed. Can I ask for it to be a time outside working hours? Or does it have to be between 9-5?

You can ask !

A meet at say 5ish or 830am'ish wouldn't seem unreasonable. That's employer's call. If you are currently working close by your old work location then you may be able to arrive late or leave a tad early one day, or even have appeal meeting at say 9am or 430pm ; make up the lost hours as requested flexitime .... or say you have a dentist or GP appointment or whatever.

I would hope that the majority of employers, inc your current and former employer, would be accommodating to such fair and reasonable requests.

RiverStar

Kayalana99 wrote: »

This thread really annoys me, I feel for you I do, but why start a thread asking for advice about your company who are 'suspending you because of a couple e-mails to your partner i.e how are you' when you knew full well the real reason?

You've been saying things about your temp manager that shes only doing it to gain points....and these 'stories' you don't have to even admit it....if you are emailing them to yourself or your partner(I really am not bothered who really I will not judge you for having a 'creative mind') you have spent works time writing them - so its not only about a 'few sex emails' its the time you've spent putting into them.... making out like they were blowing smoke out of nothing & making the company look bad for suspending you for no real reason...

Just seems like a waste of everyones time asking for advice without giving us the details....

Good luck anyway, but as they obviously have prove you've sent these emails and have reason for gross misconduct...I'd be getting those CV's out.


Edit: I would of said originally to just be honest(ish) and say you are thinking about writing an exotic novel so sometimes on your break you write emails to yourself so you can edit them later...but since you've had your meeting and I get the impression you denied it even though they will have proof of emails going in and out? I think they will have a good ground to dismiss you if they take it that far.

Hi Kay...Thank you for your response.
I welcome your observations as I do from all MSE members. I accept and respect that you do not know the full facts and circumstances. To do so may overwhelm this sub-forum and then it may be fair to accuse me of wasting people's time, Nonetheless, I can to a certain extent understand your comments. You may be right. I may be wrong. My employer may act unfairly. Time will tell.

Paypeanuts

RiverStar wrote: »

Hi ohreally
You may be right re the 'fishing expedition'. As this seemed to start with emails to my partner.
Prior to the hearing, l took advice from members on here.
I am in a union but they told me to call back when l have disciplinary hearing date.
The questions asked at yesterday's meeting were closed ie have you ever sent anything derogatory etc. I answered no. Because l don't know what exactly what they are referring to.

If they had asked and showed me something that l did send, l would've said yes that's my own private email address. I was sending to myself.

Probably because they thought you were emailing the erotic material to your partner. so the issue isn't actually about emailing your partner on occasion, it is about sending non work friendly emails on their system, thus potentially exposing them to risk. I don't think it's a fishing expedition, they've got the evidence it's gone thru their IT system!!

It's not going to go well, maybe you will get off with a written or final written, though. Depends on the workplace.

mgdavid

fruitedeli wrote: »

It's common sense. Did you think they're paying you to sit around to chat or do something else other than work? You're paid to WORK. Not to do personal things during working hours.

Employer doesn't have to talk to you about it first. It's a nice thing to do if they're lenient, but if they feel like setting an example then you're in trouble.

ridiculous post that does not reflect the real world. Possibly this poster also expects staff to ask permission to go to the toilet.