Finding a job following dismissal for gross misconduct

sensibleadvice

AP007 wrote: »

6 months? That's a bit long.

...within 6 months, probably less.

jobbingmusician

What examples (if any) are listed in your company's disciplinary policy as GM? Your actions were clearly not dishonest, and I feel it's stretching a point to call them misuse of company property!

What was the reason given for dismissing you? (Was this confirmed in writing? I mean the reason given in writing, which should relate to one of the examples given in the policy. It will of course say 'this list is not exhaustive', but there should still be some general principles underlying your dismissal.

(If you want to answer, I would summarise without quoting directly, just in case someone from your company recognises the quote).

sensibleadvice

jobbingmusician wrote: »

What examples (if any) are listed in your company's disciplinary policy as GM? Your actions were clearly not dishonest, and I feel it's stretching a point to call them misuse of company property!

What was the reason given for dismissing you? (Was this confirmed in writing? I mean the reason given in writing, which should relate to one of the examples given in the policy. It will of course say 'this list is not exhaustive', but there should still be some general principles underlying your dismissal.

(If you want to answer, I would summarise without quoting directly, just in case someone from your company recognises the quote).

If there’s nothing clearly agreed between you and your employer about a particular issue, it may be covered by an implied term.

Implied terms such as theft and fighting for example are automatically part of a contract even if they’re not written down or listed in disciplinary guidance, contracts etc.

an9i77

Shazza122 wrote: »

Thanks Seven.

I don't want to lie re what happened as I couldn't live with the guilt or fear of being found out and being sacked again!!

I had a sort of similar thing happen a good few years ago, I was abroad with work and phoned my boss from the hotel, the hotel then tried to charge me $250 for this one call (to a uk mobile) which was work related, and I panicked my boss would go mad at me if I put it through expenses so I sweet talked my way out of it and got them to cancel it, this got back to my boss and it all got twisted that I'd misrepresented my position with the company etc - anyway whatever the rights or wrongs of what I did, I was out on my ear. Ironic really as I was trying not to get in trouble and got in deeper!

I'm afraid I did lie through my teeth as I'd agreed with my boss that it wouldn't mention dismissal on my reference. It was a probationary dismissal as I'd only been there a few months so I said on my CV that it had been a contract/project and got further temp work until I no longer needed it as a reference. So temp may be the way to go. I do think they are being really harsh if you've been there four years and this is your first offence, but employers are often really, really harsh on anything to do with money/cards because of the potential for abuse.

monty-doggy

I'm rooting for you, best of luck for tomorrow. Xxx

Torry_Quine

AP007 wrote: »

I am a she thanks and if anyone here thinks its ok to get fired for GM then there is no hope.

I don't see anyone saying it's alright being fired for gross misconduct, far from it.

[Deleted User]

paulineb wrote: »

I turned up at a job about 18 months ago to get a letter saying come into work tomorrow (without representation) to basically be dismissed. I hadnt done anything.

Sounds like a clear cut case of constructive dismissal to me!
(Nothing like the OP's case, of course)

[Deleted User]

AP007 wrote: »

if you are going to be up front say you were not made aware of the terms of the card and see what happens.

I'd be very surprised if that "defence" causes the employer to re-instate.

paulineb_2

AP007 wrote: »

I am a she thanks and if anyone here thinks its ok to get fired for GM then there is no hope.

In my view, gross misconduct is something like theft, violence, fraud, turning up for work drunk or on drugs (am aware some employers may be sympathetic to people with addiction issues). But sometimes employers call anything gross misconduct just to get rid of people.

Im aware that the OP has said they have owned up to what they did, but in my case, I did nothing apart from complain about my (horrendous) working conditions after tolerating them for far too long without support. My safety was also put at risk on more than one occasion. But when I complained, they decided to dig up dirt on me and fire me. There was no dirt so they got people to lie. That can happen in a job.

I was fired for gross misconduct but I did nothing that was even misconduct as I said before.

The last time I was employed I was working for a woman who had clear issues. She was a bully, she picked on a lot of people, but she picked on me and one other girl (who was 6 months pregnant) the most. We hardly ever worked together, but she made it clear I was at the bottom of the pile, spare hours went to everyone and anyone.

I came on shift one day to find two of my colleagues blind drunk. One of them had crashed the ceiling in with a body conditioning bar (I worked in a gym). They werent sacked, one of them got promoted after that and the other given full time hours. So when her boss tried to dismiss me for gross misconduct I said bring it on. I was actually going to be sacked for not meeting sales targets (we didnt actually have an individual sales target to meet, just a number of sales calls we had to make every day), the entire gym wasnt functioning, it was failing and she wanted someone to take it out on. But I was getting letters from her and her area manager, threatening to sack me for gross misconduct. They did sack me in the end, but they couldnt say misconduct, because I hadnt done anything that was remotely misconduct. She also wrote large chunks of the company handbook and when I challenged that, I was told that was ok as I didnt have 12 months service. She changed the bits that would have allowed me representation.

I actually dont give a stuff that two employers tried to sack me for gross misconduct (one actually did), because it is possible to be on the end of a horrible witch hunt in jobs. That doesnt mean your name needs to be tarnished forever more.

As I said previously I was honest with employers. I told them the story of what happened to me, I couldnt make it up because some of the stuff that happened to me was incredible. And it didnt stop me from getting further work. The last time I was sacked I was just unlucky enough to encounter someone who had massive issues and whose business was failing and who wanted to take it out on someone.

Im aware the OP has admitted that they made a mistake. The point Im making again is that many people who are sacked for GM wont even have done anything thats misconduct. I remember being on the phone to ACAS and they told me, an employer can basically rip your contract up anytime they like.

Im actually self employed now and I'll never ever work for an employer again, Ive had too many horrible bosses. But when I was dismissed for gross misconduct, I was honest, I told new employers what had happened to me. I didnt put my ex employers down as a reference, they had previously tried to make it as tough for me as possible to get JSA due to the lies they told to the DWP about why they sacked me (the DWP found in my favour).

At the time I thought it was the worst thing that could ever happen to me and that Id never work again, I was already ill due to the treatment they put me through which continued until they sacked me and beyond. But that wasnt the case.

I dont know what the OP has done, but even in cases where someone has made a monumental boo boo at work, some employers wouldnt dismiss or automatically call that gross misconduct either, the interpretation of what is or what isnt gross misconduct can vary from employer to employer.

In both cases I spoke about my ex employers knew fine well I hadnt done anything that was remotely GM but still wanted shot of me anyway.

So dare I say it, many people who have been fired for gross misconduct may not have done anything thats misconduct, the employer just wants them out. And if people have less than two years service, its harder to take an employer to tribunal, the balance can be very much in the favour of the employer,

morganedge

When I was sacked for GM I just omitted the job from my CV, and filled in the gap with some baloney about going travelling. Worked a treat.
Not sure if you can do that, but honesty isn't always the best policy (especially in the current climate)

Good luck