What shortgage 421,306 homes built in a single year in france!

cells

2012 346463
2011 421306
2010 346018
2009 334430
2008 400191
2007 465681
2006 460294
2005 444189
2004 397715
2003 350535

Total 3,966,822 homes built in a decade, 2003-2012

If the french can build >421,000 in a single year in the middle of a recession year, 2011, why should the UK not be able to match this?

By comparision, 2011-12 UK completed 145,910

We need to build 4 million a decade like the french have done and are doing. The alternative is that the PR sector will grow rapidly in the UK as has been the case over the last 8 years and prices will ration a shortgage of homes needed

Graham_Devon

Well, land mass is an obvious point. They have far more of it, so I would assume the density of their land isn't quite the issue ours is.

Apart from that, I don't know. Certainly interesting and certainly wipes out some of the "banks wont lend so builders wont build" arguments, as I believe lending in France was even tighter than here.

Generali

OP - do you have a link to the data source please? It's almost impossible to tell anything from a simple list of numbers.

The relative ease of building is probably the biggest difference between France and the UK. The UK hasn't built enough houses for decades.

wotsthat

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Certainly interesting and certainly wipes out some of the "banks wont lend so builders wont build" arguments, as I believe lending in France was even tighter than here.

How do you know these are being financed with mortgages?

Need some meat to go with the bones of the bare figures TBH.

My own experience of France is that lots of building takes place within the big cities but, at the risk of sounding like a snob, you wouldn't want to live in them.

Graham_Devon

wotsthat wrote: »

How do you know these are being financed with mortgages?

Via statistics? Common Sense?

They have basically half (in terms of value, but then they also have lower value houses) the lending we do, but that's still a lot of residential mortgage lending, and can hardly be seen as a cash economy.

http://www.hypo.org/Objects/6/Files/HYPOSTAT%202011.pdf

mayonnaise

Graham_Devon wrote: »

http://www.hypo.org/Objects/6/Files/HYPOSTAT%202011.pdf

That's interesting. Cheers.

michaels

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Via statistics? Common Sense?

They have basically half (in terms of value, but then they also have lower value houses) the lending we do, but that's still a lot of residential mortgage lending, and can hardly be seen as a cash economy.

http://www.hypo.org/Objects/6/Files/HYPOSTAT%202011.pdf

So that is a good point Graham - are they actually building any more total 'value' of homes than the UK?!

It should also be noted that the French appear to be half way into a triple dip recession based on yesterday's growth figures...

Dunroamin

Many houses in France, outside the cities, are built by and for individuals rather than estates of speculative housing. In fact, it's often the cheapest option for FTB as land is so cheap compared to the UK with large building lots (for individual homes) being available in many areas for £15/20,000)

Prothet_of_Doom

Dunroamin wrote: »

Many houses in France, outside the cities, are built by and for individuals rather than estates of speculative housing. In fact, it's often the cheapest option for FTB as land is so cheap compared to the UK with large building lots (for individual homes) being available in many areas for £15/20,000)

Indeed. Planning is easy to get too. A french friend was given a plot as a wedding present, in his parents garden, which included a one acre orchard. He had a local builder put up a 4 bed house, which had 4 garages underneath, and had change from 80K euro. (1999). At the time an equivalent house in the UK, outside of the south east would have been £150 to 200K

IveSeenTheLight

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Well, land mass is an obvious point. They have far more of it, so I would assume the density of their land isn't quite the issue ours is.

Certainly is a valid point.
Also looking at population, France is broadly similar in population to the UK, but has been growing faster over the decades since the 2nd world war

princeofpounds

Many houses in France, outside the cities, are built by and for individuals rather than estates of speculative housing. In fact, it's often the cheapest option for FTB as land is so cheap compared to the UK with large building lots (for individual homes) being available in many areas for £15/20,000)

I've spent a lot of time in France. It's this.

In the UK, it's nigh-on impossible to locate a building plot and gain planning permission as an individual.

We are forced to rely on the Barratts of this world to 'navigate' the planning system.

We typically get far worse quality houses as a result. Mass produced plasterboard rubbish. Whereas in France you get differentiated, high-quality buildings.

People invest in them because they are going to live in them. For a mass builder in the UK actually building the houses is just a necessary annoyance in order to convert and sell agricultural or industrial land into valuable residential land, which is where all the value creation really lies given the artificial scarcity we create.

Much of western continental Europe (Belgium, Netherlands, Germany) is the same. It leads to lots of really pleasant semi-rural villages instead of squashed estate-type housing. (Obviously it's a little different in the main cities, although here planning is still much more free even if land is not)

The way they acquire economies of scale is different too. Typically people build their own house to their own design, but adopt one of the regional styles, which means that they use the same materials as many other houses in the region. You won't look like the house next door, but you might look like a house in the next village or the next street over.