marks and spencer online shopping - receipts not confirming sizes, no right to cancel

kate99999

I recently ordered lingerie via marks and spencer's website and noticed a few unusual things at ordering:
firstly you choose your size as normally carefully when you are putting things into the basket, but as soon as they have taken payment details this all disappears and all they will provide you with is a list of products and no sizes - for example with bras they list xxx bra Size A-DD (denoting they will send you any old size within this range?). Anyway, that is exactly what they did - and having looked through everything including old orders they offer nothing whatsoever saved of the carefully chosen list with sizes. even thought it must have been clear it was wrong when they sent it as I'd ordered 2 sets of bras and they sent the 2 sets -one set the right size, the second the wrong size - which surely makes little sense given their sizes are consistent across styles so it must have been clear to them again at this point (although I'm absolutely sure that I put the right size in they have just left me with no proof as they remove all the sizes) that no-one would want 2 sets of underwear with completely different sizes. Now, as I've been ill and find it difficult to do much beyond getting to work to keep my head above water financially (such as getting to a post office which isn't open outside working hours, and definitely managing to get to shops in busy weekends -hence my reason for going online) I find that they offer ABSOLUTELY no way of contacting them other than an FAQs one way section, a telephone number only available during office hours with no message machine and apparently an address - whilst happily citing they expect everything returned in a set time-frame and that underwear is non returnable (although I've made it clear that not only was it their error, but that in refusing to confirm the size of my order they prevented me from correcting this error). How do I go to the ombudsman about this? I am well and truly fed up with them, and they are breaking all rules by not offering cancellations on orders - by implementation of a policy that provides no opportunity to contact them to do so, and by basically pretending that you are ordering as normal until the order is taken then removing all sizing choices and sending through what they want providing a 'size free' receipt. I am quite frankly shocked - it's the most con-artist thing I have seen in a long time and am very disappointed as due to my health I ordered with them online specifically because I knew my sizes and couldn't get to the shops so find it outrageous they appear to have implemented a system which is making me run around like a mad person.

Can I contact my bank and go through them to demand the cost of the goods inappropriately sent through - and in actual fact can they demand these be returned in a set time or refuse to return something that they just decided to send through to me which was not what I ordered?

frugal_mike

The distance selling regulations state that when you order at a distance the retailer must send to you some specific information, includin informing you of your right to cancel the contract under the distance selling regulations and informing you whether or not you are required to pay return postage if you return items. This information must be delivered in durable form, so either by email or as a delivery note with your order. Terms and conditions on the website do not count because they are not durable as they can be changed at any point.

The above information is important because it determines how long you have to cancel your order. If they provided you with that information at the point of order or point of delivery then you have 7 working days to cancel starting the day after delivery.

If they provide it to you at a later time up to 3 calendar months after delivery then your 7 working days to cancel starts the day after they provide the information.

If they never provide that information then you have 3 calendar months and 7 working days to cancel.

Your post doesn't have timescales in it, so when did your order arrive? Did it have the information the distance selling regulations requires in durable means?

They cannot require you to send the goods back in a specific timescale, you only need to cancel the order. They also can't make refuse to accept returns of underwear.

hollydays

Haven't read your whole thread, but item bar codes can often be size specific, if this helps. So what I'm saying is though they may not send you the details ie barcode like you'd get on a receipt it's likely it's stored in their system. I'm sure there is a telephone contact number. Can't you just ring them there open till 7pm including Saturdays, ? Or email them through customer services, I think your making difficulties that aren't there.

WTFH

Sorry, I'm trying to understand your problem...
They sent you the wrong product and you want to return it, but before contacting them you want to contact the ombudsman, the bank, etc?

I did a quick search on M&S Returns, and at the bottom right of the page is a link to "Contact Us"
Then I went to Contact by Email and selected Returns & Refunds, which brought up this page:

https://www.marksandspencer.com/gp/contact/actions/subject-form-actions.html/279-6202654-2386438?ie=UTF8&mnSBrand=core

Try using that to contact them.

As for your other issues...
It's possible that you are buying underwear for 2 different people, hence two different sizes.
Secondly, you're not looking for a cancellation - you have received goods, so it's a refund you want.

kate99999

Hello,

yes I'm pretty experienced with online shopping thank you so I was rather surprised when I encountered the problems that are there:
- they do not provide any email contact address whatsoever ONLY an FAQ section which you can read - even those email addresses that that they send from are no reply. and they also appear to actually block addresses from their unauthorised senders to anything that you try (the usual guess at 'help@, customerservices@).
- I clicked on the contact button many many times and nothing providing any method of contacting actually comes up - in fact it appears to not work. hence I've been stuck with just the FAQs which provide no email details
- when you go to the list of how to contact them there are 3 options listed: the one way FAQs which provide no contact method, the telephone number only open in office hours, a postal address.
- and as explained in my previous email - no the phone number is not one which is open outside of my office hours thank you.
- the receipt they have provided/delivery note does not even offer the sizes on it. so it is interested that you feel they may have some record themselves somewhere but it hasn't been helpful to me in proving they have sent the incorrect item. I was astounded at how strange it is that my account lists my online orders 'converted' into ones which have no sizes listed when my basket prior to paying had these on (I'd love to know why this is done?!)
- and yes I am very frustrated that a seemingly respectable company appears to have made it very difficult and a case of jumping through hoops to even contact them or to notify of my wish to cancel. surely it makes sense that if I can order online and hand over my money (i.e. they take my money that way) they should offer the opportunity to contact them that way when there is a problem.
- thank you frugal_mike that is actually useful information and much appreciated - I will carefully look through all of the paperwork sent to see if there is anything detailed on it. It is just rather difficult to cancel when they don't actually offer a way of contacting them.

and yes I'm massively puzzled as having ordered from many, many retailers it's pretty weird not offering a way of contacting them via email when they are pretty happy to contact you that way so are clearly aware it is the simplest one, and the best way from the point of having a trail. the size thing is just totally strange too. Don't know who is actually running the website and distribution but it seems to break what would seem a fair contract of information provision and ability to contact each other with the not telling you what size they are going to send and also not providing a confirmation of what size you ordered when it's obviously important as to whether the product functions for you or not!
and yes all of this could be worked around with no hassle if you are a person who actually is in a position to make time and energy to walk into a store - you try being very ill and working a seriously full time job on your own and see whether that is actually possible. I haven't been able to get to shops properly for many months. But if you haven't walked in someone's shoes. ... then they wouldn't understand they would have customers who use online only because of such circumstances and need to service blueprint their service to work in such a way without the backstop of 'oh when it all goes wrong then you can come to our store anyway' - that's why I didn't buy instore!

hollydays

Have you read the replies

wealdroam

kate99999 wrote: »

- they do not provide any email contact address whatsoever...

Did you miss the link that WTFH kindly provided for you:

WTFH wrote: »

https://www.marksandspencer.com/gp/contact/actions/subject-form-actions.html/279-6202654-2386438?ie=UTF8&mnSBrand=core

I'll leave the rest of your gripes for someone else.

kate99999

HI Hollydays - if you have found the email that I can email them through can you provide it? this is the very issue that I have that they don't provide one at all and I've searched the whole website, all their emails are no-reply and even when you try and make them up (by guessing at help@, or customerservices@) they either don't work or are blocked. I've sent off over 10emails (same email to various different possibilities of email address) in the last 4 days and had no response whatsoever.

hollydays wrote: »

Haven't read your whole thread, but item bar codes can often be size specific, if this helps. So what I'm saying is though they may not send you the details ie barcode like you'd get on a receipt it's likely it's stored in their system. I'm sure there is a telephone contact number. Can't you just ring them there open till 7pm including Saturdays, ? Or email them through customer services, I think your making difficulties that aren't there.

Slowhand

kate99999 wrote: »

HI Hollydays - if you have found the email that I can email them through can you provide it? this is the very issue that I have that they don't provide one at all and I've searched the whole website, all their emails are no-reply and even when you try and make them up (by guessing at help@, or customerservices@) they either don't work or are blocked. I've sent off over 10emails (same email to various different possibilities of email address) in the last 4 days and had no response whatsoever.

Have you tried the link in post #4 kindly supplied by WTFH? Y/N?

kate99999

HI Quizzical Squirrel,

it is! I checked through the online order history several times over the last few days expecting this and it was now exactly the same as what you probably found (as I did) on your despatch emails - i.e. with the sizes removed even on the order history. I've just logged in now and clicked on the order and now the sizes are there - don't know what happened but at least they are there now. so thank you for the response as whatever it was just as well I tried one last time! Just have to find an email address for contacting them about returning things now .... lots of info about returning in general, but few contact details! I can understand the idea about cutting down email traffic by using FAQs... but literally cutting all email communication possibilities out altogether? even companies like BT at least offer a 'form' to email them!

Quizzical_Squirrel wrote: »

That's strange because I just looked at my online order history and sizes are shown there. For example, I have an order last year for ordinary bras and one this year for sports bras and both have the sizing. Each order I've placed for any item does have the sizing.

But when I look at the emails, there is never a size confirmation in the order nor the dispatch emails. Those are an abbreviated version of the order.

So I think if this happened to me, I'd be able to prove it was their mistake. It's unfortunate that this isn't the case for your particular order.

Slowhand

From the M&S website:-

[EMAIL="customer.services@marks-and-spencer.com"]customer.services@marks-and-spencer.com[/EMAIL]

I don't think it's a problem with M&S. Found in less than 1 minute.