Successful complaints about private parking tickets - how to get them cancelled!

Umkomaas

cheltenham_ross said:

Well, I need to post here, to say thank you for the support of those on the board. Plan A wasn’t viable, as NCP own the car park, but plan B did work. Ticket cancelled today. Thanks all!

Nice. But who actually cancelled the ticket?  And for what reason?

cheltenham_ross

Umkomaas said:

cheltenham_ross said:

Well, I need to post here, to say thank you for the support of those on the board. Plan A wasn’t viable, as NCP own the car park, but plan B did work. Ticket cancelled today. Thanks all!

Nice. But who actually cancelled the ticket?  And for what reason?

NCP. I used the template everyone told me to use. The letter said based on my email the ticket was cancelled.

firstgear

Hi, I wanted to thank everyone who has contributed to this forum (especially Coupon Mad). I have just had a parking charge notice cancelled (by Parking Eye at first stage after initial appeal). Before seeing this forum I did not think "beating them" was an option! I was ready to pay the £60. So thank you!

My case is straightforward but I wanted to give back nonetheless.

I visited Welcome Break Membury East and stayed for 2 hours 18 minutes. During that time I purchased nearly £70 worth of goods (mostly food and fuel). Travelling with 3 kids one of which is a newborn and the other two are 5 or under.

Key info:

• Received PCN from Parking Eye for the Welcome Break Membury East M4
• I had no receipts, but did use a card, so was able to screenshot transactions in my app (the screenshot of transactions looked naff and would be easily forgeable, but it's the best I had)
• I sent an "appeal" to Parking Eye (see below for the content)
• I sent an email complaint to Welcome Break at the specific branch's address (membury.enquiry@welcomebreak.co.uk)* telling them that I expect the charge to be cancelled (see below for content)
• PCN cancelled by Parking Eye approx 1 week after sending the appeal
• I sent the first appeal around 10 days after receiving the PCN (I was worried the 10 days would work against me as showing someone who's not angry or organised enough)

*Please note elsewhere on the forum it is said that each Welcome Break has their own website and email address, but I did not find this to be the case. However, I kept searching and found the email of a different Welcome Break branch in a thread on MSE that was in the format: "{branch}-enquiry@welcomebreak.co.uk". I then searched google for "membury-enquiry@welcomebreak.co.uk" and got some hits, leading me to believe that it was likely correct. When I sent the email it didn't bounce. Therefore I assume someone is monitoring that email address.

I believe my case was a straight-forward cancel as the total (alleged) over-stay is 18 minutes which may fall within 10 minute grace periods on entry/exit (from what I've briefly read). I also stopped for fuel. I was a genuine customer with _some kind of_ proof of purchases (albeit a shoddy screenshot from an app). I doubt they cared about the kids/newborn.

If it wasn't as straightforward as I believe it is, then I would have phoned Membury to complain and chased them up, rather than just sending an email. I was nervously confident though (easy to say now.. truth is more likely that I just don't have time to sit on the phone all day chasing).

PS. WB Membury are silly really. There are so many service stations in close proximity and I plan to travel that route several times a month for the the foreseeable (likely at least ~2-3 years). But, I look forward to using their toilets and napping before spending money elsewhere.

Content of appeals and complains below, in case someone finds this useful:

---- Start: Appeal to Parking Eye submitted via their online portal

I dispute your 'parking charge', as the keeper of the vehicle. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. Since your PCN is a vague template, I require an explanation of the allegation and your evidence. You must include a close up actual photograph of the sign you contend was at the location on the material date as well as your images of the vehicle.

If the allegation involves an alleged overstay of minutes, your evidence must include the actual grace period agreed by the landowner.

In order to resolve the dispute, I inform the recipient of this message that:

* Three of the vehicle’s occupants were small children, aged 5 and under, including a newborn baby of X weeks. In order to transport the newborn to and from facilities, the adult occupants were required to remove the newborn car seat and refit it upon returning the car, as well as adjusting and refitting the car seats for the other child occupants as necessary.

* The driver and occupants of the vehicle were genuine customers, having spent a total of £68.95 across 4 separate transactions, 3 of which were towards the end of the overall visit. Please note that 1 of these transactions falls outside the confines of the car park (see next point).

* The final purchase of the driver and their occupants was of fuel at the onsite petrol station. Therefore the car was not parked at this time, yet no evidence has been presented in the PCN to show that the times and photos are not inclusive of time spent at the petrol station, or searching for the petrol station.

* The service station in question was undergoing renovation at the time of visit, and therefore, access to certain areas was restricted and/or blocked from view. Evidence provided would need to be like-for-like with the state of the site on the day/time of visit, as temporary construction structures like those used are subject to regular change based on work being carried out.

---- End: Appeal to Parking Eye

Then I sent a complaint to Welcome Break Membury at the membury-enquiry@welcomebreak.co.uk address:

---- Start: Welcome Break complaint

Dear Site Manager,

Note: if this has not reached the site manager, would you please forward the email to the site manager on my behalf or provide me with their email address. Thank you.

I visited the Welcome Break Membury M4 East service station just over a week ago and have just received a parking charge notice for “staying 2 hours and 18 minutes”.

 

I am totally shocked to get penalised for being a customer.

 

I spent £68.95 on: KFC, coffee, one of those little kiddie rides, and petrol. I did not see a single sign on entering the car park, in the building, in the petrol station, or exiting the car park, or the site as a whole. Not a single word about parking costs or limitations.

 

At approx 9pm when I entered the site, the car park was practically empty. And it wasn’t any more full when we left.

 

I was travelling with 3 kids, one of them is a newborn (X weeks old) and needed their car seat to be removed from the car and refitted when we got back (unless you don’t want us to stay for food, as we can’t eat if we’re carrying baby in our arms). Those 3 kids don’t eat particularly quickly, can be messy (which I spent time helping to clear up), and need to go to the toilet (multiple times). One of them is an exclusively breastfeed newborn, whose eating schedules and various bodily functions we cannot control. Note: I cannot safely drive while the baby is being breastfed. I was feeling extremely tired and needed a break from driving (the day prior I was driving from 4am and have had regular sleepless nights since the arrival of the baby)

.

IF I had been a less courteous customer, not purchased coffee, fuel, or entertainment (those kiddy rides in the lobby), then I would surely have come under the 2 hours minimum required “free” parking period quite comfortably given that we exceeded it by a whopping 18 minutes.

I expect that you do not want genuine customers - people who are willing to spend money - to avoid using your services in future. I don’t want to be petty about it by avoiding all Welcome Breaks (especially M4 East!). I would just like the charge cancelled, so I can continue being a customer.

 

There is a service station quite literally 12 miles down the road (that’s 12 minutes if you’re driving 60 mph) so I could, in future, stop at your services just to use the toilets and have a bit of rest, before continuing on to the next station to spend money (buy food, etc etc). Again, I would rather not be petty about it, but if I’m going to be held to these sort of ridiculous charges, then it’s actually the best strategy to ensure I maximise effective use of your parking rules (I still dispute that the parking charge issued to me is enforceable, accurate, or  represents a breach of contract, but that’s another debate).

I’ve attached proof of purchases (note this is an app screenshot as my credit card statement won’t be generated for another couple of weeks).

 

Here are the details from Parking Eye’s PCN:

Ref Number: XXX/YYYY

Vehicle Registration: AB12 CDE

Date of Event: dd/mm/yyyy

Arrival Time: dd/mm/yyyy hh:mm:ss

Departure Time: dd/mm/yyyy hh:mm:ss

If Welcome Break is not the landowner and unwilling to instruct ParkingEye to cancel the charge, would you please give me the landowners details so I can make a complaint additionally to them (I will be doing so by sourcing their info myself if I don’t hear back).

Regards,
Joe Bloggs

---- End: Welcome Break complaint

I'll finish off on a positive note by saying that I have also learned from this experience.

1) I am a fairly new driver and thought all service stations had free parking for customers. They are expensive enough (!). OK lesson learned.

2) Get receipts. Keep receipts.

3) Get a dashcam. It would have been useful if I needed to prove time of entry/exit, that I went to get fuel, the visibility of parking signs, etc. It's likely a useful purchase anyway, and I've been meaning to get one. This has given me one more reason why getting a dashcam is a good idea.

Maybe petty (let me know if you think it is). But I'm also going to send a follow up complaint to WB Membury to let them know that they didn't get back to me in time, and so I will not be visiting their lovely service station anymore for paid services. This whole thing was extremely stressful and time consuming (e.g. reading lots of posts on this forum) so I think they deserve an additional complaint that stresses this.

Anyway, thank you again to the forum. I am curious about one thing, and so I'll end with a question. What are people here doing when they need a nap?

That is..
A) Do you make sure you pay the parking?
Do you ignore it, knowing you're "allowed" to park for a nap (thinking here of the lawyer who won a case where he received a PCN for napping in the car park)?
C) Something else?

Cheers

Umkomaas

Very well done on taking this to PE and WB, great result. Not su e whether it was your level of spend or the fact you were a breastfeeding mother that caused PE to dip out. 

Maybe petty (let me know if you think it is). But I'm also going to send a follow up complaint to WB Membury to let them know that they didn't get back to me in time, and so I will not be visiting their lovely service station anymore for paid services. This whole thing was extremely stressful and time consuming (e.g. reading lots of posts on this forum) so I think they deserve an additional complaint that stresses this.

I certainly don't think it petty. In fact this gets right to the core of the issues ultimately facing landowners - the loss of business because of their association with private parking firms, their own seeming unwillingness to intervene on behalf of their customers, and the negative impact on their profitability. 

Go for it, let us know how they respond, please.

Coupon-mad

firstgear said:

Anyway, thank you again to the forum. I am curious about one thing, and so I'll end with a question.

What are people here doing when they need a nap?

That is..
A) Do you make sure you pay the parking?
Do you ignore it, knowing you're "allowed" to park for a nap (thinking here of the lawyer who won a case where he received a PCN for napping in the car park)?
C) Something else?

Well done on your success!

Seems they expect you to pay £11-£15 to stay for a nap but despite that being a tariff structure, no motorist knows this (except geeks like us).

ParkingEye don't put this in 'big' on the signs and nor are there any obvious paypoints:

https://www.welcomebreak.co.uk/journey-planner/parking/#:~:text=Following%20the%20first%202%20hours,the%20charges%20at%20each%20location.&text=Payment%20for%20parking%20is%20taken,Smith%2C%20petrol%20forecourts%20etc.)

"Every Welcome Break site offers 2 hours free parking to all motorists. For those motorists wishing to stay longer than 2 hours, there is the option to pay for additional parking time as detailed on the signage within the car park. If parking regulations are not adhered to a Parking Charge Notice will be issued.

Tariffs

Car parking charges apply after a free 2 hour period. Following the first 2 hours, cars are required to pay £15 for 2–24 hours, at all Welcome Break locations."

Someone else who didn't know this was Nicholas Bowen KC, who stopped for a nap:

https://amp.theguardian.com/money/2017/aug/26/parking-eye-takes-on-top-barrister-85-fine

  

firstgear

Umkomaas said:

Very well done on taking this to PE and WB, great result. Not su e whether it was your level of spend or the fact you were a breastfeeding mother that caused PE to dip out. 

Maybe petty (let me know if you think it is). But I'm also going to send a follow up complaint to WB Membury to let them know that they didn't get back to me in time, and so I will not be visiting their lovely service station anymore for paid services. This whole thing was extremely stressful and time consuming (e.g. reading lots of posts on this forum) so I think they deserve an additional complaint that stresses this.

I certainly don't think it petty. In fact this gets right to the core of the issues ultimately facing landowners - the loss of business because of their association with private parking firms, their own seeming unwillingness to intervene on behalf of their customers, and the negative impact on their profitability. 

Go for it, let us know how they respond, please.

I suspect it was the level of spend or that I bought fuel, and therefore they knew they couldn't prove a full 2 hours "parked".

Will let you know. I CC'd the main WB customer service email address as well.

Fruitcake

Following a stay at the Holliday Inn Express, Filton, Bristol, I received a paper firelighter for my wood burner stove from DCB Ltd, but never received a NTK from the PPC, Parkmaven Ltd. I complained to the UK CEO of Intercontinental Hotels Group Ltd and the hotel itself.


Email to Elie Maalouf, UK CEO of IHG Ltd, and copied in the hotel.

Sir,

      I am the registered keeper of a vehicle owned by my wife, and I have just received a debt collection letter from a company called Debt Collections Bailiffs Ltd demanding payment of £170 on behalf of an unregulated private parking company called Parkmaven Ltd.

      Whilst the debt letter gives sparse details, I have ascertained that it relates to an alleged parking event when I was a guest at the Holiday Inn Express Hotel, Bristol, Filton, on the 29th/30th of August 2023. The car park at this hotel is monitored by your sub-contractor agent, Parkmaven Ltd, but I note there is no mention of this on the hotel website, nor the possibility of hotel guests being taken to court for a minor parking infringement such as entering an incorrect registration number, even if they were not the driver.

      The driver at the time of the alleged event has shown me a digital receipt for payment of the full parking tariff, (£5), so I am at a loss to understand why I have received this demand for payment.

      To compound matters, your agent, Parkmaven Ltd, failed to issue me with a Notice to Keeper at all, and has made no contact with me whatsoever, despite the fact that I have lived at the same house for over 40 years. It seems strange that their correspondence, which would have offered a discount payment, did not arrive, yet the debt company letter demanding nearly three times the discounted amount did.

      You should be aware that passing a parking charge straight to debt collectors without giving the motorist the opportunity to appeal is a breach of the British Parking Association’s Code of Practice, of which Parkmaven is an approved operator scheme member.

      The debt collector has included a fake add-on fee of £70, routinely thrown out by judges dealing with parking court case, and referred to as “An attempt at extortion,” by Neil O’Brien MP, when he was the Parliamentary Under Secretary of State at the Department for Levelling Up, Housing and Communities.

      Due to ill health, I am not able to travel as much as I used to, but as a member of the IHG Rewards programme for over 20 years, I would be grateful if you would instruct your agent, Parkmaven Ltd, to cancel the parking charge.

 

Regards

Fruitcake – Registered Keeper

Vehicle Registration Mark: -                   LLNNLLL

Parkmaven Parking Charge Number: - NNNNNNN

IHG Rewards membership number: -   MMMMMMMMM

Response from hotel.

Hi,

We have forwarded your fine for cancellation.

Many thanks

Guest Services

Holiday Inn Express® Bristol - Filton

Response from one of mister Malouf's staff. (Note the USA address, and the comment that the CEO had read my complaint)

Dear Fruitcake,

Greetings from the Executive Office of IHG.  Mr. Elie Maalouf, CEO, IHG, received your email about the Parkmaven charges you received after your time at the Holiday Inn Express Bristol - Filton, and has asked I review this situation on behalf of IHG as a whole, and to help you get in contact with the appropriate individuals.  

 I'm truly sorry to learn of the frustration you experienced after receiving the Parkmaven fine.  IHG wants all guests to be able to clearly see, and be aware of, any car park registration policies, and I apologize that you have a record of paying for the parking and then getting a parking fine.  I want to make sure the individuals responsible for the daily operations are notified, as IHG isn't involved in this independently owned hotel's car park policies.  As the management of the hotel is in the best position to make sure this matter gets addressed appropriately, I'm including the General Manager, Jamie Rees, in this email.  Jamie oversees their car park policies and car registration.  

Hi Jamie, please see the below email from Mr. Fruitcake.  Will you or a member of your management team please look into this issue and contact him directly as soon as possible?  

Thank you, 

Amanda Bentley

Executive Liaison 

IHG® Hotels & Resorts 

P.O. Box 30321, Salt Lake City, UT 84119 

By the time I had received the exec staff's email, the charge was no longer appearing on the Parkmaven website, and replied with this.

Amanda,

      Thank you for your swift response, however I am pleased to say that the hotel staff have already beaten you to it and had the parking charge notice (it is not a fine) cancelled. I have already sent an email thanking them for this.

      It appears the driver entered the registration of the car they normally drive, not the borrowed car they were driving on the day in question. This should normally have resulted in a parking charge notice being issued to the registered keeper, me, and the offer to pay a reduced amount of £20 being given. This should also have resulted in the ability to appeal to a (non-independent) body funded by parking companies. The problem was that no parking charge was issued to me, the registered keeper, at all, let alone the offer of a reduced charge nor the opportunity to appeal.

      The charge was then passed to a debt collector, in breach of the parking company's trade association code of practice, and an additional fake charge of £70 was then added to the original £100 charge. A demand for £170 seems extortionate to me when the original fee to park is only a very reasonable £5, which was actually paid, albeit against the wrong car registration mark.

      This error on the driver's part was however a result the parking industry's refusal to roll out "typo-proof" payment terminals. These high-tech terminals make it impossible to pay for a vehicle that is not present in the car park, and flag an error if an incorrect registration mark is entered. 

      

      If the hotel in question is to bring itself up to the high standards expected of the IHG mark, then the owners should insist that their unregulated parking agent installs typo-proof payment terminals to ensure this sort of error is not repeated.

      

      I would though like to say how otherwise enjoyable my stay was at this particular hotel, and indeed at every IHG hotel I have ever stayed at across several continents over the last 20 years. The level of proficiency and friendliness of staff has been consistently high irrespective of whether I stayed one night or one month.

Regards

Fruitcake

Leafy89

Euro Car Parks Parking Charge Notice cancelled by Sainsbury's Manager in Braintree, Essex. Spoke to Sainsbury's Manager in person with copy of my parking charge notice, copies of credit card statements proving I am a regular customer. Manager cancelled the notice whilst I waited and received a cancellation email from Euro Car Parks.

user57

Heathrow PCN cancelled using NEWBIES template, the reply went on about their terms and conditions but at the end it said "In conclusion, we will waiver this PCN, but must inform you that the terms and conditions in this location advise the driver that they must pay for each visit to the site.", the reason for cancellation was not given.   Many thanks for everyones’ help on this website.

Le_Kirk

user57 said:

"In conclusion, we will waiver this PCN, but must inform you that the terms and conditions in this location advise the driver that they must pay for each visit ..............

Did it really say "waiver" if so there can only be one person working there as they all erroneously state "waiver" when it should be "waive"!