Channel 4 9pm

~Chameleon~

KxMx wrote: »

Fakers, moaners and bad attitudes aside, where some see excuses others (usually with close experience of disability) see realistic and rational thinking.

That is certainly true. Without specific experience one truly cannot judge another unless you know them extremely well. And you cannot always judge another with the same illness/condition/disease as no two people are afflicted or suffer or react in the same way.

A little compassion, understanding and tolerance goes a long way

nannytone_2

liam8282 wrote: »

Again, if you read my comments, I am generalising, where as you are talking about individual specific scenarios, of which I have never questioned or disagree with.

it is the generalising that is the problem.
you are treating all disabled people as if the issues one has, applies to all disabled people.
each disabled person has their own issues and difficulties but they arent common to us all.
even people with the same condition can have different issues.

so to pick out individuals and explain them away as if they are the exception is ridiculous.
we are a group of individualsan that have individual problems.
a one size fits all approach will never work

youve asked me why i dont work in a call centre.
i pointed out the transport issues, including the fact that the last bus runs at 5. according to you... an excuse.
i pointed out that crowded noisy places confuse me ( bus station) as i cant see... you said... i went to alton towers so its an excuse ( i went with my daughter and her family, so not alone)
i need special software and in a nisy environment of a call centre would struggle to concentrate .... an excuse?
call centres tend to be large spaces, filled with obstacles , people and peoples belonging so an obvious hazard to a blind person.... an excuse?

not excuses... just a few examples of what i struggle with.
not all blind people struggle with the same things.
but as i said ... we may all be disabled but we are NOT all the same

liam8282

nannytone wrote: »

it is the generalising that is the problem.
you are treating all disabled people as if the issues one has, applies to all disabled people.
each disabled person has their own issues and difficulties but they arent common to us all.
even people with the same condition can have different issues.

so to pick out individuals and explain them away as if they are the exception is ridiculous.
we are a group of individualsan that have individual problems.
a one size fits all approach will never work

No, I have not said that this applies to every disabled person. If you have read my comments, I said the exact opposite.

That is where the whole problem arises in this thread, people making issues out of nothing.

I am talking about the "Karens" of this world, I have never brought into question anybody with genuine disabilities that cannot work.

nannytone wrote: »

youve asked me why i dont work in a call centre.

I have never asked you why you don't work anywhere?

nannytone wrote: »

i pointed out the transport issues, including the fact that the last bus runs at 5. according to you... an excuse.

That is the same for everybody, disabled or not. So yes, an excuse.

nannytone wrote: »

i pointed out that crowded noisy places confuse me ( bus station) as i cant see... you said... i went to alton towers so its an excuse ( i went with my daughter and her family, so not alone)

Yes, you did say that noisy crowded places confuse you, and that you avoid them.

I pointed out that you went to Alton Towers, one of the busiest, nosiest crowded places you could chose to go. Further more, you said that you looked after the kids whilst your daughter went on some rides and vice versa. So, yes I do see this as picking and choosing situations that you can cope with, when you want to.

nannytone wrote: »

i need special software and in a nisy environment of a call centre would struggle to concentrate .... an excuse?
call centres tend to be large spaces, filled with obstacles , people and peoples belonging so an obvious hazard to a blind person.... an excuse?

I don't know who gave you the call centre as an example. There are many other places to work, other than call centres.

nannytone wrote: »

not excuses... just a few examples of what i struggle with.
not all blind people struggle with the same things.
but as i said ... we may all be disabled but we are NOT all the same

Yes you have given many varied examples of things you struggle with, but no examples of things you could do.

That is where some people differ.

nannytone_2

the issue is being in noisy, crowded places ALOVE. as my daughter wouldnt be accompanying me to work then as most people are... id be alone.
yes i looked after the kids.
sat at a table with a 9 year old and a baby strapped in a pram.
not walking around trying to find a bus!
would i be sat on a bench, not moving, when catching a bus?

the buses stopping at 5 are an issue for everyone. but a non disabled person would hgave the option of walking, riding a bike or driving. all of which are not available to me when i am out alone.

i have said the things i have issues with, and would love a solution.
i worked for 30 years previously, but all jobs that required sight.
if i knew what i could be doing workwise now, i would be doing it!!
if you suggest a serious work opportunity that may be available and i would thank you whole heartedly.

so not excuses.
just things and issues that disabled people live with 24 hours a day.
they dont only impact on our ability to work, but on everything that people do as part of a normal existance.
life is difficult enough already, without people saying we are making 'excuses' for struggling to find any kind of employment

ab.da54

tomtom256 wrote: »

It was clear her ailments are not as bad as she made out, just look how she moves about!

And how did she move about?

Clip showing her walking, taking small steps and stopping, due to pain.

What did you see?

liam8282

ab.da54 wrote: »

And how did she move about?

Clip showing her walking, taking small steps and stopping, due to pain.

What did you see?

Well she managed to get herself to the assessment, driving her car which had no adaptions.

She managed to carry her handbag in one hand, which was about the same size as the bag of pototoes, yet she couldn't lift a single potato from the desk.

She managed to pick up and put her grandson on her knee, with no signs of struggle or pain.

~Chameleon~

liam8282 wrote: »

I am talking about the "Karens" of this world, I have never brought into question anybody with genuine disabilities that cannot work.

And who exactly are the "Karens" of this world? You're basing your judgement on the view of a snapshot of one person's life via an extremely edited television programme. The programme showed you exactly what they wanted you to see. These programmes are nothing short of government propaganda.

liam8282

nannytone wrote: »

i have said the things i have issues with, and would love a solution.
i worked for 30 years previously, but all jobs that required sight.
if i knew what i could be doing workwise now, i would be doing it!!
if you suggest a serious work opportunity that may be available and i would thank you whole heartedly.

I think you have taken this to heart as a personal attack on yourself, when it was never intended in that way. I have only replied to comments that you have directed toward myself.

My problem is with the "Karens" of this world.

After a 30 second google search, I hope these help, without wanting to be pedantic....

http://www.diversityjobs.co.uk/?gclid=CK2YyuHpibkCFcfJtAodXCkAgQ

http://www.rnib.org.uk/livingwithsightloss/working/Pages/working.aspx

http://www.euroblind.org/about-ebu/ebu-employment-website/blind-and-partially-sighted-people/

ab.da54

liam8282 wrote: »

Well she managed to get herself to the assessment, driving her car which had no adaptions.

She managed to carry her handbag in one hand, which was about the same size as the bag of pototoes, yet she couldn't lift a single potatoe from the desk.

She managed to pick up and put her grandson on her knee, with no signs of struggle or pain.

Was there a clip showing the inside of the woman's car so that we can be sure whether or not there were actually any adaptions?

Before the assessment, a clip showed her struggling to put her coat on, and her face signalled she was in pain.

Next, we see the door closing, then we see her walking to the assessment place, walking slowly and stopping. The bag was in the same hand as the walking stick she was using.

The bag of potatoes she was asked to lift, weighed 12lbs. Despite her bag looking large, it did not look full and most likely didn't weigh 12lbs.

She did not say she could not pick up a single potato, she said it caused pain in her shoulder region when she reached for it.

We did not see her pick up her grandson and put him on her knee. First clip shows him leaning into her for a hug and she puts her left arm round him. Next clip shows him sat on her lap.

There is no scene which shows how he moved from a standing to a seated position, however, he was not a very young child and past the age of needing to be picked up to sit on his Grandma's knee.

liam8282

~Chameleon~ wrote: »

And who exactly are the "Karens" of this world? You're basing your judgement on the view of a snapshot of one person's life via an extremely edited television programme. The programme showed you exactly what they wanted you to see. These programmes are nothing short of government propaganda.

Yes I accept that the programme was edited and that Karen was the panto villain, it doesn't mean to say that there aren't many others like her in society and that they are a growing problem.

I notice how everybody liked the comment when the disabled rights protestors on here started talking about the x factor generation, but isn't that just the same thing as this argument? Generalising an entire age group for those that don't want to work?