Redoing very small ensuite bathroom

keystone

HopelessAtSaving wrote: »

I hope it wont take much longer than 5 days but we always get quoted for the whole job irrespective of time taken so if it overruns, it won't cost extra.

As I said the price looks right for the job irrespective of how long it actually takes to complete. I just think 5 elapsed days is on the optrimistic side.

Regarding tiles, I wanted large tiles to minimise grout lines, husband wanted natural stone/marble appearance as he felt they would not date easily, and obviously they need to be light coloured as room is small and need to maximise appearance of light/space.

Really big tiles look pants in a small space IMO. Irrespective of grout line considerations you need to consider what it will look like.

I understand the Eagle tiles need to be sealed post installation and then every few months after? What's your experience? I'm not the best at maintenance and would prefer tiles as fuss free as possible. Are there any others you can recommend with a similar look?

IMO ALL porcelain and natural stone tiles need sealing with a good impregnator/sealer twice. Once after installation and before grouting and again after grouting. If they were highly absorbent tiles I'd seal before installing too. After that they should not need sealing again unless you need (or have a burning desire) to strip them right back 'cos they are a tad "dirty" and start again. By that I mean the 0.00001 micron dirt layer that some people seem to be able (or claim to be able) to see from 50 paces.

Cheers

somethingcorporate

I can evidently only go on what work I have had done, the kind of tradespeople I have employed and the cost and quality I have received and give my point of view.

I think you're getting ripped off, I am renovating a 2000sq ft house for twice the cost of redoing a small ensuite.

I'm in the north so used to things being cheap I guess.

FYI - I'd expect labour rates to cover overheads, not to pay more for things that I could get myself by popping down to wickes. Given it's £300pd for labour I guess the expectation for tilers to earn £70k+ a year and make a margin on materials means they are bleeding well paid compared to up north!

southcoastrgi

& yet again someone ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ who hasn't a clue how a business works

keystone

somethingcorporate wrote: »

I can evidently only go on what work I have had done, the kind of tradespeople I have employed and the cost and quality I have received and give my point of view.

Fine but you described a perfectly normal business practice as stupid.

I think you're getting ripped off, I am renovating a 2000sq ft house for twice the cost of redoing a small ensuite.

A complete renovation for £ 10k. I have a problem believing that I'm sorry to say. - See how easy it is to use less provocative language.

FYI - I'd expect labour rates to cover overheads, not to pay more for things that I could get myself by popping down to wickes.

Actually I did explain thats how my business model works for me as regards things like bathroom suites and tiles but perhaps you missed that?

Given it's £300pd for labour I guess the expectation for tilers to earn £70k+ a year and make a margin on materials means they are bleeding well paid compared to up north!

Who said it was a £ 300 day rate? The part of your sentence starting "I guess" is tragically silly because you are not thinking things through properly.

Cheers

somethingcorporate

Did the OP not suggest that it was 5 days labour or did I make that up? At ten days it's more reasonable. At 5 days labour at £1,400 / 5 = £280 per day. I have an excellent tiler who costs just over half this (and gives me his trade discount on materials).

As for not having a clue how a business works I quite vehemently disagree, I don't have much insight into how two-bit tradespeople work but have plenty of experience advising corporates and running budgets in the tens of millions and being paid quite handsomely for it.

Again, I am only going by the experience I have had with the tradespeople I have used and trusted. Most have been more than happy to pass on their trade discount on materials when it comes to things like tiles and materials so I'd be shocked and certainly not use one that jacks up their prices to cover OH costs I think their labour cost should cover. But hey, I guess we have different standards as to what is acceptable. Most tradespeople that come to my door I have found to be next to useless and unreliable and it has taken a great deal of time and effort to find some ones that I would actually trust.

One that gives me nearly a £5k estimate for a small ensuite would be joining the pile of ones that gave me a £12k estimate for a full re-roof when in reality it cost less than half this and £3k for sound-proofing one wall on a small room when again it cost less than half.

It's your money OP but suggest you shop around ALOT and not listen to folks who's job it is to talk up the rate of their profession. Every premier league footballer will tell you that £200k a week is good value

notanewuser

We refurbed our en suite 3 years back. It's about 6ft x 6ft. We didnt move any plumbing, but replaced all of the tiles, plasterboard around the shower with wetboard and put in:

Utopia fitted units and solid worktop
V&B mirrored cabinet with light and shaver socket
Glass bowl sink and new designer tap
Slate tile floor
900m quadrant shower cubicle and white gloss times from B&Q laid in a brickwork pattern.

Added bisazza mosaic glass tiles as a border to add some interest.

Did all the work ourselves and it still cost about £4k.

keystone

somethingcorporate wrote: »

Did the OP not suggest that it was 5 days labour or did I make that up? At ten days it's more reasonable. At 5 days labour at £1,400 / 5 = £280 per day. I have an excellent tiler who costs just over half this (and gives me his trade discount on materials).

Sorry but I have to point out that 5 elapsed days doesn't necessarily equal 5 mandays and nowhere does the OP suggest that it does. Its an assumption you've made so your £ 300 a day is based on little more than thin air and it would be quite wrong too.

As for not having a clue how a business works I quite vehemently disagree, I don't have much insight into how two-bit tradespeople work but have plenty of experience advising corporates and running budgets in the tens of millions and being paid quite handsomely for it.

There you go again with the pathetic insults. OK so tell me all about gross margin then and margin on cost and how these things are different and tell me please how much your coporate pays for an M10 bolt and how much that M10 bolt ends up actually costing the end customer once it crosses his threshold. No you don't understand because in practice its no different. Its a question of scale thats all.

Again, I am only going by the experience I have had with the tradespeople I have used and trusted. Most have been more than happy to pass on their trade discount on materials when it comes to things like tiles and materials so I'd be shocked and certainly not use one that jacks up their prices to cover OH costs I think their labour cost should cover

Different businesses have different business philospohy's and different models. You surely understand that. What you think they should cover?? How completely arrogant. Thats not your business. You have a choice as does the tradesman. In this case OP got an inclusive quote from the tradesman. Hwe could have asked for a quote based on him getting the major bits. He didn't. The prices will be different as a result. Don't blame everyone else for your own poor experience.

But hey, I guess we have different standards as to what is acceptable.

Thats quite pathetic. Its nothing to do with standards. Oh and BTW whats your consultancy day rate?

Most tradespeople that come to my door I have found to be next to useless and unreliable and it has taken a great deal of time and effort to find some ones that I would actually trust.

Ahh. An axe to grind then. Stop projecting your prejudices onto everybody else please.

It's your money OP but suggest you shop around ALOT and not listen to folks who's job it is to talk up the rate of their profession.

More stupid insults - am just about fed up with your ad hominems. But without that you are absolutely correct and thats why I told the OP right at the top of the thread that they need at least two more quotes for exactly the same scope of work. Or did you miss that?

Cheers

PS: Oh and by the way how come you are being so vehement on this thread about how much things costs and you can get them done for half the price whereas your contribution to the "replace a porch" thread actually came up with the right sort of number in my estimation.

somethingcorporate

We're derailing the conversation here and I cannot be bothered to enter into a pointless debate over gross margin, my day rate, the differences between a tradesman buying at trade and then marking up and the complexities of a full corporate supply chain or alleged slights you feel I have given against you, footballers and tradesmen in general.

Let's condense the debate into something sensible:

1) Tiler thinks cost is reasonable.
2) Someone that had a very similar thing done just last week paid a lot less thinks it is unreasonable.
3) We both agree on the answer - shop around and get a better quote.

keystone

somethingcorporate wrote: »

We're derailing the conversation here and I cannot be bothered to enter into a pointless debate over gross margin, my day rate, the differences between a tradesman buying at trade and then marking up and the complexities of a full corporate supply chain or alleged slights you feel I have given against you, footballers and tradesmen in general.

OK backing off then. Sounds like a good plan so I'll be generous and take this (whether you meant it or not) as an apology for the insults too.

Let's condense the debate into something sensible:

1) Tiler thinks cost is reasonable.
2) Someone that had a very similar thing done just last week paid a lot less thinks it is unreasonable.
3) We both agree on the answer - shop around and get a better quote.

Thank you. Yes. Concur.

Cheers

somethingcorporate

Given you invented the insults I am happy for you to invent the apology.

:beer:

Edit: Pretty sure it was you that laid into everything I said because you disagreed.

I'll invent an apology from you too.