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kirkbyinfurnesslad_2

Well done on doing this single issue alone

Guys_Dad

I don't want to be a wet blanket and I applaud the decision to go with the single point appeal, but I do urge OP to look at posts #318 & #319 on the POPLA decisions thread and the reason given by the adjudicator.

I believe that c-m is well up with her advice and is right in her assessment and advice. The problem is that the adjudicator may not be and look at the case simply as a parking contract matter.

It is your money that is at risk although if you lose you have court to fall back on if they pursue it where a judge may be better informed and, of course, you have GPEOL to use as well.

In your position I would go with the single point as you have done as I wouldn't mind a day in court if I lost at POPLA and could afford to pay if I lost. And the education from the POPLA hearing would be invaluable for here based on an informed appeal such as yours.

But I really hope that this is not going to cost us our proud boast of 100% success and your money as I have real worries about the breadth of legal experience and knowledge of the adjudicators.

Good luck and I will be rooting for you.

Parking-Prankster

I congratulate you on your courage to take this single issue to POPLA. It cannot have been an easy decision. However, it will help countless people in the future to know POPLA's ruling on this.

I think that it also may be worth sending in an email to POPLA along the lines of.

Dear POPLA administrators,

This case involves legal issues which are not commonly raised in POPLA appeals. I understand that the Lead Adjudicator oversees a certain percentage of appeals. I request that given the unusualness of this case and the fact that this case is of concern to disabled motorists everywhere, that this is one of those cases.

Put your POPLA code in the email subject and body.

Stroma

I don't think its that unusual considering the number of disabled motorists, but points of law should always be above terms and conditions in a car park. Popla is supposed to consider points of law, if they don't know the only real legislation that could cover parking then they need to be retrained. I don't by the way consider pofa as point of law on parking, all that is about who to blame, or keeper liability.

nigelbb

Include this from the FAQ on the POPLA website just to ram home that the Equality Act trumps car park T&Cs

How does the Assessor make their decision?
Having examined the evidence presented by both parties, the Assessor has to come to a conclusion about what actually happened (make findings of fact). The Assessor then considers the BPA Code of Practice to the extent that it is relevant to these facts and finally applies any relevant law.

http://www.popla.org.uk/FAQs.htm

rsclark

Thanks for the support

@umkomaas: I wouldnt be surpised either. But i don't want that to happen. A lot of effort has gone into the POPLA appeal and i think it needs to be properly considered.

Guys_Dad wrote: »

The problem is that the adjudicator may not be and look at the case simply as a parking contract matter.

I believe that the appeal includes enough mentions of EA and explanations that it would be difficult to view it simply as a parking contract matter.

Guys_Dad wrote: »

It is your money that is at risk although if you lose you have court to fall back on if they pursue it where a judge may be better informed and, of course, you have GPEOL to use as well.

In your position I would go with the single point as you have done as I wouldn't mind a day in court if I lost at POPLA and could afford to pay if I lost. And the education from the POPLA hearing would be invaluable for here based on an informed appeal such as yours.

Clearly, i do not want to pay, but can afford to if necessary. I would probably even be prepared to go to court, but I am doubtful if the PPC would be prepared to take it that far.

Guys_Dad wrote: »

But I really hope that this is not going to cost us our proud boast of 100% success and your money as I have real worries about the breadth of legal experience and knowledge of the adjudicators.

Whilst it is great to boast a 100% record, you still need to test the cases on the fringe else how do you know where the fringe is. Isn't having a 99% success rate and knowledge that a certain defence will not work more useful?

@ Parking-Prankster @nigelbb
The original appeal was submitted some time ago hammering the EA. Following the PPC defense I have submitted a further response again highlighting EA and that it trumps their rules. I don't think i am going to send anything else. I have faith in what has been prepared by C-M and Trubster.

As i said at the top of the post, I hope that POPLA don't get another opportunity to side-step making the decision. I want a decision. Even if it goes against me I will fight on.

Guys_Dad

I urge you to send the Prankster's letter. If this is to be a test case, then having the lead adjudicator's considered opinion would be significant and may avoid a junior adjudicator making a bad decision.

Oh, we have lost our 100% already (hopefully temporarily) so not an issue and I agree with you on that point.

Umkomaas

You're taking a great stand and I'm sure all the regulars are really looking forward to the result. It will be a landmark (from a forum perspective) case, regardless of outcome. Either it is upheld and upsets the PPC apple cart on this issue, or POPLA decide to fly in the face of the law.

Nice dilemma.

Coupon-mad

Guys_Dad wrote: »

I urge you to send the Prankster's letter. If this is to be a test case, then having the lead adjudicator's considered opinion would be significant and may avoid a junior adjudicator making a bad decision.

Oh, we have lost our 100% already (hopefully temporarily) so not an issue and I agree with you on that point.

No worries, it's already pretty much covered in this poster's POPLA appeal evidence which was the best attempt we could come up with, and ended:


'POPLA assessor, please refer this matter to the Chief Adjudicator and Legal Dept if unsure in this regard, because contract law cannot take precedence when the EA says such terms are rendered unenforceable.'






P.S. And I don't think we have lost the 100% result because I suspect that the poster in question didn't firmly attach points 3, 4 and 5. I could be wrong but that's what I said I suspected, on his thread. The assessor clearly only saw points 1 and 2 so the rest was either deleted before printing (when he was deleting stuff, by his own admission) or not firmly attached with POPLA code on every page. His loss.

rsclark

The 'on or after' date has passed. I realise this date was simply x days after the appeal was lodged, but does anyone know how long a routine appeal takes?

I am still thinking this one may get conveniently forgot about, or cancelled if POPLA are reluctant to make the correct decision.

But still getting a little nervous every time i open my email program!