After the Work Programme

donnajunkie

sensibleadvice wrote: »

Negative mindset comes from not recognising the underlying reason for failure and will remain a negative mindset whilst blaming the wrong things like govt WP etc for their failings.

People can choose to do something about their negative mindset though but they have to be true to themselves and admit the true problem first. They don't because it's much easier to blame everything else.

negative mindset has nothing to do with whether a person recognises their own failings (if any) or not. the negative mindset as you like to word it comes from negative experiences of the jobcentre, providers etc.

donnajunkie

sensibleadvice wrote: »

Keep telling yourself that's the right approach and you'll no doubt have been and will remain in the same unemployed position for years.

doing that has nothing to do with a persons employment chances. for your information i judge everything fairly. if i find something to be of quality i embrace it. still doesnt guarantee success though.

donnajunkie

BillJones wrote: »

I really feel for these advisers, having to repeatedly see the same, smirking faces, hands out for state money, and ready with a complaint the moment things don't go their way. It must be soul-destroying to realise that you are being judged on your inability to get these sort of people back into work.

As others have said, there are some people who we need to accept can't be helped. They should be parked o the minimum possible amount of benefits, and left to their own devices. It is a waste of good people's time and efforts to pretend that anything can ever be done for them.

This would free up resources for people who are genuinely trying, and who would benefit from whatever help is available.

Fortunately the government seem to be similarly minded, and we are hopefully moving in the right direction niw.

i agree with alot of this but not all of it. good advisers get very little grief. bad advisers get lots of grief usually because they dish out lots of grief. so i have no sympathy for them at all.
the government isnt thinking along the lines of what your post says at all. they demonise all the unmeployed and put them all on pointlesss courses and they do things like set targets on sanctions. the governments only agenda is to cause suffering.

donnajunkie

well had my fun ujm session at the jobcentre today. the people who took it were horrible people setting out to instill fear into the group. trying to make out if you dont give them access to your ujm account that that increases the chances of you being sanctioned, so you should give access. they said if we phone you about a job and you arent home to answer the call you will get sanctioned and that if you give them access that wont happen because they can send the message via ujm instead. i thought yeah and what if the message arrives after i have logged off for the day? you can miss a message in whatever form it takes. then they proudly boasted that both of them have no problems at all with dishing out sanctions. ap007 would have loved them. i was sat there thinking i wish ap007 was here so i could watch them giving these pair of tw*ts grief. oh and i was right i didnt learn anything i didnt already know.

red_devil

I dont know how they think that this approach will get people into work.

donnajunkie

red_devil wrote: »

I dont know how they think that this approach will get people into work.

the approach is everyones a scrounger and making their lives hell will make them take a job.

AP007

donnajunkie wrote: »

well had my fun ujm session at the jobcentre today. the people who took it were horrible people setting out to instill fear into the group. trying to make out if you dont give them access to your ujm account that that increases the chances of you being sanctioned, so you should give access. they said if we phone you about a job and you arent home to answer the call you will get sanctioned and that if you give them access that wont happen because they can send the message via ujm instead. i thought yeah and what if the message arrives after i have logged off for the day? you can miss a message in whatever form it takes. then they proudly boasted that both of them have no problems at all with dishing out sanctions. ap007 would have loved them. i was sat there thinking i wish ap007 was here so i could watch them giving these pair of tw*ts grief. oh and i was right i didnt learn anything i didnt already know.

So hang on you just THOUGHT that but didn't say it out loud to them? The bit where you said you could have logged off? I don't think anything should be logging off anything before the JC have gone home for the day (5pm).

Yes I would have loved them as I would have asked them to only call my mobile and that I sleep with it.
Then I would have asked them to show me where it says that if the JC call on the home phone and you are in the loo and have no voicemail you get a sanction!!!

So you didn't learn anything but did you speak up??

mro

BillJones wrote: »

I really feel for these advisers, having to repeatedly see the same, smirking faces, hands out for state money, and ready with a complaint the moment things don't go their way. It must be soul-destroying to realise that you are being judged on your inability to get these sort of people back into work.

As others have said, there are some people who we need to accept can't be helped. They should be parked o the minimum possible amount of benefits, and left to their own devices. It is a waste of good people's time and efforts to pretend that anything can ever be done for them.

This would free up resources for people who are genuinely trying, and who would benefit from whatever help is available.

Fortunately the government seem to be similarly minded, and we are hopefully moving in the right direction niw.

I assume you have no recent experience of being unemployed and signing on at Jobcentres.

It is almost non existent in the signing area that unemployed give advisors grief. This is a myth, certainly in my area. I doubt many unemployed would complain as advisors could easily get revenge.

Because Jobcentres don't hear the full truth from most unemployed, as they are too scared of being given a hard time or being sanctioned, Jobcentres are completely deluded about the effectiveness of programmes, courses & help they offer.

Most advisors don't want to listen & hear the truth.

You really don't have a clue about what happens in Jobcentres and how useless they are.
.

mro

red_devil wrote: »

I dont know how they think that this approach will get people into work.

Nobody in Jobcentres really cares, it doesn' matter to them, as long as that is what the managers & Tory politicians want.

The basic idea is, the harder you make it, the more likely people will find work, take any job or be forced off benefits.

AP007

mro wrote: »

Nobody in Jobcentres really cares, it doesn' matter to them, as long as that is what the managers & Tory politicians want.

The basic idea is, the harder you make it, the more likely people will find work, take any job or be forced off benefits.

Because they must be dim and think most people are getting job offers they are turning down.