How can any parent do this?

keyser666

Think it was more despicable that she was celebrating a 10k win on th postcode lottery weeks after his death.

Idiophreak

Lou67 wrote: »

It's always the same kind of people that treat their kids like this too The kind that have pitbulls that attack their own grandchildren and call their kids dumb names like Shantelle, and Xander, and Tyler and Ashleeeigh, in a world where it's not uncommon for a woman to become a granny at 35 or younger.

The kind of family that make peoples lives a misery with their chavvy barbeques and kids screaming in the garden bouncing up and down on their trampolines, while their (19 y.o.) mum is on the laptop playing internet bingo with Jeremy Kyle on the telly.

I'm talking about sink-estate underclasses: the badly treated, badly neglected children almost ALWAYS come from this kind of family, because many of them are not having children because they want them. Ergo; they have no CLUE how to look after them, nor do they actually want to.

With families and mothers like this; who have 'I really want a child' not even on their list of reasons for pro-creating, these poor, tragic little children stand no chance.

May this little boy rest in peace.

Excellent post.

Not sure I 100% agree with the content, but brilliantly written

Lagoon

RuthnJasper wrote: »

I do try and tell them that, if they keep paying attention at school then they could ACTUALLY achieve anything they want to be or do. But I doubt it sinks in.

I think it's great that these children have that kind of influence from you, and know that you're someone they can go to for the support and encouragement they're lacking elsewhere.

I grew up in the kind of house you're describing, and I do think that what you're doing will make a difference to some of those kids. My immediate family were what I'd consider 'first generation chavs'. From a decent, working/middle class background my mother chose that lifestyle. Her siblings continued as the generations before them, but she was happy to settle on a council estate and take up a life of benefits, drinking, violence and generally being quite hateful of everyone and everything around her. Throughout my childhood and everything I experienced, however, I kept one thing in mind. Before she'd passed away when I was very small, my grandmother had told me that if I worked hard, I could shape my life and be whatever I wanted to be. That stuck with me, and in some of the worst times it's what kept me going, and it's proven to be true.

My younger siblings never met her, and they were taught not to value learning and hard work. Things that take effort aren't worth doing, as far as they know. When we were at university, OH said to me that my siblings would see what I was doing and hopefully it would show them what could be achieved. The reality was that my mother showed them my student loan statements, told them it was a waste of money and pushed the idea of university out of their heads.

People like you (and my grandmother) make a difference with what they say, though. I guess now it's like the path of the family has split in two - my immediate family being the offshoot from the main path. Thanks, I believe, to what my grandmother said, I'm back on the main path. No doubt the 'chav' portion of the family will continue for more generations now that some children have been raised that way, but I firmly believe that if you can change the path for just one person then you've done something truly remarkable, so keep doing what you're doing.

ThumbRemote

Lou67 wrote: »

It's always the same kind of people that treat their kids like this too The kind that have pitbulls that attack their own grandchildren and call their kids dumb names like Shantelle, and Xander, and Tyler and Ashleeeigh, in a world where it's not uncommon for a woman to become a granny at 35 or younger.

The kind of family that make peoples lives a misery with their chavvy barbeques and kids screaming in the garden bouncing up and down on their trampolines, while their (19 y.o.) mum is on the laptop playing internet bingo with Jeremy Kyle on the telly.

I'm talking about sink-estate underclasses: the badly treated, badly neglected children almost ALWAYS come from this kind of family, because many of them are not having children because they want them. Ergo; they have no CLUE how to look after them, nor do they actually want to.

With families and mothers like this; who have 'I really want a child' not even on their list of reasons for pro-creating, these poor, tragic little children stand no chance.

May this little boy rest in peace.

Top stereotyping. Well done.

sweetstudent

MamaMoo wrote: »

And then there was the woman who threw her baby down a rubbish chute in Wolverhampton..

I live close to that are as well and the strange thing is she only got jailed for 2.5 years.....it does make me wonder how soft a country we actually are and that the criminals HR mean more to our judicial system that the victims themselves

pmduk

sweetstudent wrote: »

I know that there have been failures to protect the child but this needs to be the last case, how many more innocent children must suffer at the hands of these vile excuse for a life.

But as a society are we prepared to pay the financial, and social cost, of separating children and parents at an earlier opportunity. Remember this is equally damaging to children, particularly when unjustified.

If only anybody had the full answer.

I'm sure social workers will be found as easy scapegoats for this, but scant attention will be paid to the workload and financial constraints we place upon them to do an unpleasant and difficult job.

Idiophreak

pmduk wrote: »

But as a society are we prepared to pay the financial, and social cost, of separating children and parents at an earlier opportunity. Remember this is equally damaging to children, particularly when unjustified.

Obviously I can't speak for "society", but I'd be 100% happy paying whatever it costs to get all children into stable, loving environments as quickly as possible. What's clear is that the existing care system doesn't work brilliantly and doesn't have anything close to the capacity required.

I'm in the unfortunate position of hearing far too frequently of children that need to be taken out of their home environment - but aren't at quite enough risk for social services to take immediate action...It really makes me feel sick - and I don't even like children!

pmduk

The problem is, it isn't you or I allocating the funds. The politicians making these decisions are usually sheltered from the consequences of the cuts they make.

RuthnJasper

Lagoon wrote: »

I think it's great that these children have that kind of influence from you, and know that you're someone they can go to for the support and encouragement they're lacking elsewhere.

I grew up in the kind of house you're describing, and I do think that what you're doing will make a difference to some of those kids. My immediate family were what I'd consider 'first generation chavs'. From a decent, working/middle class background my mother chose that lifestyle. Her siblings continued as the generations before them, but she was happy to settle on a council estate and take up a life of benefits, drinking, violence and generally being quite hateful of everyone and everything around her. Throughout my childhood and everything I experienced, however, I kept one thing in mind. Before she'd passed away when I was very small, my grandmother had told me that if I worked hard, I could shape my life and be whatever I wanted to be. That stuck with me, and in some of the worst times it's what kept me going, and it's proven to be true.

My younger siblings never met her, and they were taught not to value learning and hard work. Things that take effort aren't worth doing, as far as they know. When we were at university, OH said to me that my siblings would see what I was doing and hopefully it would show them what could be achieved. The reality was that my mother showed them my student loan statements, told them it was a waste of money and pushed the idea of university out of their heads.

People like you (and my grandmother) make a difference with what they say, though. I guess now it's like the path of the family has split in two - my immediate family being the offshoot from the main path. Thanks, I believe, to what my grandmother said, I'm back on the main path. No doubt the 'chav' portion of the family will continue for more generations now that some children have been raised that way, but I firmly believe that if you can change the path for just one person then you've done something truly remarkable, so keep doing what you're doing.

Bless you, Lagoon, that's such a lovely post. I'm so glad that you are doing really well. I don't think I am a naive or daft person, but when I first moved to my little house, on my first night here (and it was the first time I had ever lived anywhere away from my parents), I'd gone to bed early and some of the children were playing in the street. When I heard a child who could only have been 4 at most screaming "Get off my f***ing bike, you c**t!" at his younger sister I actually cried.

But the kids are actually quite fun to be around, and they even ask if they can wash my car for me or help me with the garden, hehe (I don't let them though, I'm not into child-slavery!). They just really enjoy having a good conversation with someone who actually listens to what they're saying and thinks that their opinions are worthwhile. One of the older boys was quite into the RMS Titanic after he'd been to a museum in Southampton - it's something I've been interested in since they found the wreck in 1985 and I've got quite a lot of books. I loaned him one of the bigger books (plenty of pictures - the poor lad was nearly 11 at the time and could hardly even spell his own name) and the look on his face when I assured him that I trusted him to look after the book and bring it back when he'd finished with it was amazing - and heartbreaking. I don't think anyone had ever said that they trusted him before. His little sister Sophie said that he kept the book beside his bed and looked at it every evening. AND he brought it back as promised.

What a world. Kids don't understand money, or social stigma, at that age - all they want is reassurance that they are loved and trusted. And that doesn't cost anything.

One of my favourite films is 'Parenthood' (with Steve Martin, back when he was great ) - do watch it if it's ever on TV. It's so funny and full of great lines. One of them, as delivered by Keanu Reeves' drifter-type character in a rare moment of lucidity is particularly relevant. He says:

"You know, Mrs. Buckman, you need a license to buy a dog, to drive a car - hell, you even need a license to catch a fish. But they'll let any butt-reaming a$$hole be a father."

R. xx

P.S. Another fantastic quote comes from the late, great Jason Robards (playing the family patriarch). Of life as a parent, he says:

It's like your Aunt Edna's a$$. It goes on forever and it's just as terrifying.

unholyangel

RuthnJasper wrote: »

What a world. Kids don't understand money, or social stigma, at that age - all they want is reassurance that they are loved and trusted. And that doesn't cost anything.

Perhaps you should pay them a few quid to wash your car for you? (yes i know you said they're not yours but even £1 gives them something if they were doing it for free anyway!) Not being funny but even from a young age I had to do chores if I wanted pocket money. I got my first part time job at 12 and first full time job (while still full time at high school) at 15 and continued to work at least part time even when studying. My family werent struggling, just I'd always been taught if you want something, you need to earn it. During school holidays when mum had went back to work, she used to take us in with her and all the kids would sit and put stickers on hangers. We even got paid £5! I didnt (and still dont) think its child labour. We had a great time and it taught us values!

TBH I think that in general (not talking about abuse etc), that we need to toughen up on kids and stop nanny'ing them so much. We give them no responsibility at all then all of a sudden, flip the switch and they have all these responsibilities and dont know how to deal/cope with them.

pawsies wrote: »

He's not getting raped in prison though :cool:

And even if he is, he's probably isnt being impregnanted with his half sibling against his will. The likes of him made me laugh when that MP said homosexuals cant provide a safe/secure environment for a child. Yes because us hetros are doing such a bang up job.


Whoever said about hoping the guards/inmates got a hold of her/remembered their own kids they were missing......the sad truth of it is she'll likely be in a secure wing for her safety (oh the irony).

However, its also not unknown for guards to turn a blind eye depending on the circumstances.

Oh and people also use kids (even babies) to smuggle drugs into prison. Some people really don't deserve to have kids.