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Immigration vital to the Nation's finances...
Comments
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HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »Because the facts are that immigrants commit less crime than the native born, claim benefits at a lower rate than the native born, are a net economic benefit to society compared to the native born, and neither take jobs from, nor reduce the wages of, the native born on average.
There are a plethora of reasoned arguments to refute everything you have just said that have been posted on this board which you conveniently ignore.HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »But when you obsess about the evils of immigrants on every single thread about immigration, use misleading statistics instead of facts,
The last three official references I posted were from Parliament. Two were regarding the rights of EU Immigrants to claim benefits and were non disputable facts - they were direct links to current legislation - yet you claim I use misleading statistics?
If you want to see misleading facts - you need look no further than the tin pot report released as propaganda which you have posted in your original post in this thread and tried to pass off as factual.HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »substitute anecdotal stories for evidence,
Anecdotal evidence Hamish - get your facts right. And I don't substitute anecdotal evidence for statistics - I use the two sources in conjunction to gain an informed opinion. Statistics will often use incomplete data, estimates and assumptions so is often plain wrong. Anecdotal evidence is important and can prompt a closer look at inaccurate statistics.HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »and then present absolutely preposterous claims such as it's commonplace for immigrants to be eating swans and pooping in the streets,
First of all I didn't say it is commonplace. But I guess it depends what you define to be "commonplace". It's happening enough to be an issue - and it is not a preposterous claim.HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »we have no choice but to assume you are in fact a racist.
"we" being you and Mr Pricklepants - neither of whom's opinions are really taken seriously.0 -
If as has been suggested on these threads that certain UK companies are advertising for workers in the EU only and that these aren't notified or made available to Job Centres in this scountry isn't that discrimination?"If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
There's an argument that immigrants are vital to the future of the UK's finances.
There is also an argument to suggest the contrary is true. Besides - the UK has benefited from migration for years. The problems I am pointing out are with open border - uncontrolled migration. Seriously - how many times?The link provided by Hamish is less than persuasive
No kidding.and I'd suggest that the UK is being targeted by benefit tourists due to a) high benefits b) unrestricted access to the NHS and c) the gulf in living standards between the UK and some of our European partners.
Those points are true.However, stories about 'dirty foreigners' really don't add to the debate - they're simply intended to be inflammatory.
I wasn't the one to raise it on this thread - that was Mr Pricklepants. But you are wrong - they are not inflammatory comments - they are factual comments. FYI it's Hamish who leads the way with inflammatory comments in his attempt to strengthen his argument.0 -
This is one area where the data is reasonably clear - immigrants are less likely to claim benefits.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16643677
IMO it depends upon the country of origin. Polish people for example will be better educated than your average Slovak and they are more likely to return home because of the higher standards of living there. I can't see why anyone would want to return to Slovakia under any circumstances.
Errr...
Have you seen London? Page 9 of the report showing 48% of non uk nationals are claiming working age benefits against 13% of the native born?
Depends how you look at the statistics and what you compare each statistic against.
So, you could suggest that in 10 out of 11 areas of the country, immigrants claim less in benefits than the native born.
However, you could also look at the numbers and that will show something quite different thanks to the massive amount (just shy of half of all immigrants!) of non nationals in London claiming benefits.0 -
Assessments should be made before arrival. A basic English test and evidence of a completed education would be a start. That would already be significantly more than the current requirements.
I start with the assumption that there are no jobs that UK residents can't do; including the BoE job.
we need a specific quota system
half the world can speak basic english and a certificate is pretty easy to obtain.0 -
Time to send them all back; lets start with anyone descended from the Angles or the Saxons. Only true celts here please.0
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“The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie – deliberate, contrived, and dishonest – but the myth, persistent, persuasive, and unrealistic.
Belief in myths allows the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought.”
-- President John F. Kennedy”0 -
Graham_Devon wrote: »Errr...
Have you seen London? Page 9 of the report showing 48% of non uk nationals are claiming working age benefits against 13% of the native born?
Depends how you look at the statistics and what you compare each statistic against.
So, you could suggest that in 10 out of 11 areas of the country, immigrants claim less in benefits than the native born.
However, you could also look at the numbers and that will show something quite different thanks to the massive amount (just shy of half of all immigrants!) of non nationals in London claiming benefits.
I would have thought anyone coming from the EU to live here and claim benefits would by now be here already, including the Romanians and Bulgarians.
If they are self employed they have the right to reside, which gives them access to CTC and CB once their children also come over, or from the day they arrive if they have their children in tow. After a while they will pass the habitual residence test which will give them further access to public funds like housing benefit and council tax benefit.
Yes, they may not currently be able to get jsa, but that hasn't stopped 80,000 Romanians coming here already.0 -
Graham_Devon wrote: »Depends how you look at the statistics and what you compare each statistic against.
I was looking at the basic headline.....Almost 17% of all British nationals receive these benefits compared with almost 7% of all those classed as non-UK nationals when they first arrived in the UK.
It's obvious really - the intention of most immigrants is to work.
This stat doesn't mean that they are/ will be beneficial to the UK economy but it's important to get the basic facts right.0
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