You can cancel your Orange contract!

powerful_Rogue

RC, DP - Im hoping you may be able to help!

I read some guidance bu Ofcom in the past relating to copies of terms and conditions being sent out in a quick and timely manner etc....however for the love of me cant find this guidance to reference in my comments. Ive tried searching for the past 30 minutes on the Ofcom website butnot having much luck!

Just wondering if either of you had any idea where I could find it?

RandomCurve

powerful_Rogue wrote: »

RC, DP - Im hoping you may be able to help!

I read some guidance bu Ofcom in the past relating to copies of terms and conditions being sent out in a quick and timely manner etc....however for the love of me cant find this guidance to reference in my comments. Ive tried searching for the past 30 minutes on the Ofcom website butnot having much luck!

Just wondering if either of you had any idea where I could find it?

I have come across that to and was also looking for it again when putting my claim together, but like you I could not find it again either!

RandomCurve

Don't forget to change the items in RED to your original price plan (original original if you had a price increase in April 2012 as well) and contract length.

Send by email to:
[EMAIL="executive.office@everythingeverywhere.com"]executive.office@everythingeverywhere.com[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="olaf.swantee@ee.co.uk"]olaf.swantee@ee.co.uk[/EMAIL]
And "CC" it to:
[EMAIL="OCCtelecoms@Ofcom.Org.uk"]OCCtelecoms@Ofcom.Org.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="watchdog@bbc.co.uk"]watchdog@bbc.co.uk[/EMAIL]


Dear Mr Swantee

I write in connection to the price rise applied to my account on 10th April.

As I was not expecting a price rise in what I believed to be a fixed contract I have reviewed the contract and concluded that the price rise clause is not compliant with the Office of Fair Trading (OFT) Unfair Terms in ConsumerContracts Regulations 1999 (UTCCRs) relating to price rise clauses in consumer contracts as endorsed by Ofcom.

The OFT requirements of good faith mean that price variation clauses should be clear and intelligible and should be brought to the customer’s attention. The price rise clause in our contract does not comply with these requirements.

Orange, at no point during the sales process, clearly and adequately drew my attention to the fact that my fixed term contract (with fixed deliverables by Orange) contained a clause allowing Orange to vary what I believed to be a fixed price. Additionally the price rise clause is not highlighted within the contract. Both of these points show that our contract is in breach of schedule 2 of the UTCCRs 1999 - OFT guidance 12.4 - and therefore renders the clause unenforceable.

In addition to the breach of schedule 2 the contract is also in breach of schedule 7 (OFT guidance 19.3) as the term is not in plain and intelligible language. To comprehend that the contract allows for a price rise it appears that I am required to read and understand the following lengthy, and confusing clauses and how they interact:

· 4.3;
· 4.3.1;
· 15(1)a; and
· 15(1)b.
These clauses are separated within the contract and appear on pages 5, 9 and 10 of a 12 page contract.

Given the above breaches render the price variation clause unenforceable by Orange I request that Orange immediately apply sufficient credit to my account to keep the service charge at the agreed fixed term contract figure of £XX.XX for the duration of our XX month contract. As this claim is based on a breach of the UTCCRs it is not subject to a 30 day time limitation.

If Orange do not concur with my interpretation above of the UTCCRs as applied to the contract then please provide me with a deadlock letter in order that I can take my case to CISAS without delay, as we will have entered into a genuine dispute.



Regards

RandomCurve

When you receive a reply from Orange post it here and I will give you my opinion on how to respond.

crispy_chris

Your second bold and underlined bit says plan instead of plain. Ironic considering what the bold bit is referring to, but you may wish to correct it

RandomCurve

crispy_chris wrote: »

Your second bold and underlined bit says plan instead of plain. Ironic considering what the bold bit is referring to, but you may wish to correct it

Thanks - now corrected.

All the rules can be found here if you want to follow the detail (and have few hours to spare!):

http://www.oft.gov.uk/business-advice/unfairterms/guidance/OFT311/Groups/


I should add that I have no legal training and it is up to every one to decide if they want to follow the advice or not. The letter is based on both what BBC Watchdog have ben saying and the result in my favour from CISAS that the term is unenforceable.

Good luck.

RandomCurve

[QUOTE=RandomCurve;62861583
I have a number of objectives I wanted to achieve as follows:

1. Have my T-Mobile contract terminated penalty free
   1. Achieved
2. Help as many as others as possible to also have their T-Mobile contracts terminated penalty free
   1. On-going, but mainly achieved
3. Get Ofcom to rule that T-Mobile price rise breaches T&Cs and force T-Mobile to write to all customers offering them a penalty free cancellation - or a discount on their contract to remain with T-Mobile .
   1. On-going. Ofcom are on the back foot and have admitted errors and are reconsidering if action should be taken - I have also managed to engage my MP in the matter, who was horrified at ofcoms woeful lack of action on this matter.
4. Have the Orange price rise clause deemed unenforceable
   1. Achieved with the most comprehensive of reasons why it is unenforceable on so may levels
5. My ultimate objective - Get Ofcom to rule that ALL Mid term price hikes are unenforceable and rule that ALL mobile phone companies have to repay the sums taken from their customers under these unfair terms
   1. This is a big ask, but again Ofcom are on the back foot, my MP is also supporting me and by achieving objective 4 above puts Ofcom on some decidedly dodgy ground!

[/QUOTE]

Sorry to quote myself, but I missed out another objective!!

Given EEs disgraceful behaviour on both the T-M and Orange price rise I am also trying to ensure that should EE try and float on the London Stock Exchange that the current Board headed by Olaf Swantee :wave:are not allowed to continue as directors.

To my mind they have proved that they have breached the duty of care that they owe to the company by stating - via their legal team - that EE took a "business risk" to apply an RPI rate to the T-M contracts that had not been published. That decision (if I can achieve Objective 3 above) will have serious consequences for the company I would not want my pension fund investing in a company headed by directors who openly admit to taking such risks.

DamePeggy

I’ve had the chance to read the adjudicator’s judgement on RC’s claim (#171) and I’m still not happy with how he’s managed to find for EE on the reading of Clause 4.3.1. I’m wondering about his statement that

“However, as the customer has pointed out I must have regard to the intention of the parties and the purpose of the clause. In my view the primary intention of the parties is to…”

I don’t think RC missed out a ‘without prejudice’ statement in the claim – did he just ignore it? I’d say RC’s case made it abundantly clear why no such interpretation of the intention of the parties was necessary.

Anyone trying to make the claim on Clause 4.3.1. should definitely makes sure that any arguments you raise about the intention of the clause are made ‘WITHOUT PREJUDICE’ to your statement that Clause 4.3.1. must be taken on face value (for the reasons RC has made in earlier posts).

I still also think there’s a good argument to make about the understanding of that reference to refer to the current RPI and will be making that point ‘without prejudice’ in my partner’s claim.

DamePeggy

powerful_Rogue wrote: »

RC, DP - Im hoping you may be able to help!

I read some guidance bu Ofcom in the past relating to copies of terms and conditions being sent out in a quick and timely manner etc....however for the love of me cant find this guidance to reference in my comments. Ive tried searching for the past 30 minutes on the Ofcom website butnot having much luck!

Just wondering if either of you had any idea where I could find it?

The Ofcom general conditions (which EE have been quoting re-changes in Ts&Cs) have this to say about Ts&Cs. I think the most relevant part is 10.3 - there's no comment about timely, but it's pretty clear that the company have a responsibility to provide you with a copy if you make a reasonable request - or just parts of the Ts&Cs too.

"10. TRANSPARENCY AND PUBLICATION OF INFORMATION
10.1 The Communications Provider shall ensure that clear and up to date
information on its applicable prices and tariffs (which for the avoidance
of doubt shall not include bespoke or individual prices and tariffs), and
on its standard terms and conditions, in respect of access to and use of
Publicly Available Telephone Services by End-Users is published, in
accordance with paragraphs 10.2 and 10.3.
10.2 The information published shall include at least the following:
(a) the Communications Provider’s name and Major Office address;
(b) a description of the Publicly Available Telephone Services
offered;
(c) where the Communications Provider renders any subscription
charge or periodic rental charge, details of which Publicly
Available Telephone Services are included within such charge;
(d) the Communications Provider’s standard tariffs, including details
of standard discounts and special and targeted tariff schemes,
with regard to:
(i) access;
(ii) all types of usage charges; and
(iii) any maintenance services;
(e) any compensation and/or refund policy, including specific details
of any compensation and/or refund schemes offered;
(f) any types of maintenance service offered;
(g) the standard contract conditions offered, including any relevant
minimum contractual period; and
(h) any available dispute resolution mechanisms, including those
developed by the Communications Provider.
10.3 Publication of the information shall be effected by:
(a) sending a copy of such information or any appropriate parts of it
to any End-User who may reasonably request such a copy; and
(b) placing a copy of such information on any relevant website
operated or controlled by the Communications Provider, or,
where no such website exists, placing a copy of such
information in every Major Office of the Communications
Provider such that it is readily available for inspection free of
charge by members of the general public during normal office
hours.
10.4 For the purposes of this Condition:
(a) “Communications Provider” means a person who provides End-
Users with access to and use of Publicly Available Telephone
Services, except Public Pay Telephones;
(b) “Major Office” means a Communications Provider’s registered
office and such other of its offices as the Director may from time
to time direct."

powerful_Rogue

Thanks DP, thats very very helpful.

I dont suppose if you had 5 minutes, whether you would mind taking a quick glance over my CISAS response before I send it off?