Add your feedback on energy supplier Sainsbury’s Energy

_Kismet

Vortigern wrote: »

If I were to follow your suggestion of switching to a new supplier, I would have 2 suppliers owing me money and a third taking money from me. It would be absolute madness to attempt a further switch.

Agreed!

Over on the Ovo thread it was suggested I could switch regardless of the current situation and I argued that I'd rather have Sainsbury's Energy sort out their mess first. I hope that happens sooner rather than later.

I have never had any issues with Ovo so I actually regret trying to leave them. For the quality of customer service, I now reason I would've been ok staying with them as I feel that the saving I might make by this switch to SE isn't big enough to be worth this extra hassle.

Hern

One issue which has so far remained unaddressed is the extent to which deliberate misrepresentation has occurred in regard to this promotion. Factually, British Gas has paid Sainsbury's a sum of money to use the supermarket giant's name and capitalise on its reputational goodwill. Representationally, British Gas has created and caused to be printed "Sainsbury's Energy" letterheaded stationery complete with the following assertion:

Working together with British Gas

British Gas has also created and caused to be printed "Sainsbury's Energy" envelopes complete with the exact same assertion:

Working together with British Gas

But. . .It isn't. There is no "Sainsbury's Energy". No registered corporate entity of that name anywhere in the UK. No record of that name anywhere in the files of Companies House.

"Sainsbury's Energy" . . . does not exist.

What does exist, instead, is some very small print -- print at nothing like the size of Working together with British Gas -- at the bottom of the letterheaded stationery:

Sainsbury's Energy is the trading name of British Gas Trading Limited.

On which basis, therefore, British Gas is working together only with. . . British Gas.

The question arises, therefore, as to what possible motive British Gas could have for announcing to its newly captured customer base that it is working with itself. No other company in the entire history of advertising and marketing has gone that route. Marks & Spencer has never said it is "working together with Marks & Spencer". John Lewis has never said it is "working together with John Lewis". Ford has never said it is "working together with Ford".

But British Gas has. And British Gas continues to say so -- once it is realised by people who thought they were dealing with a company called Sainsbury's Energy that actually, they're dealing with British Gas. Realisation, unfortunately, seems to have come too late to a number of posters on this comment thread. Laments along the lines of "If I'd known it was British Gas, I'd never have gone near this offer" are easily found. I'm adding my own to that list, right here, right now.

Setting aside what seems to have been one of the worst attempts ever at perception manipulation -- an endeavour that could surely not have been accidental by a company as monumental, and with as massive an advertising spend, as this -- the question is: what now?

Because if British Gas is working together with anyone at all, then it is working together with yet another name from whom there is much goodwill to be exploited ("gilt by association", to use the ad industry's deliberately punning terminology). British Gas is working with. . .

Moneysavingexpert.com. Martin Lewis's very own Moneysavingexpert.com. British Gas has managed to bag not one but three trusted consumer brands in one go: Sainsbury's; MSE; and Martin Lewis. That's quite a coup.

Whether Sainsbury's has anything to contribute to the examination of this debacle isn't clear. Perhaps someone might like to write to the company and ask it (and especially anyone who has written on this thread that they'll never shop at Sainsbury's again!)

It seems to me Martin Lewis may not necessarily have known much about its genesis, either. But MSE does.

I don't hold MSE responsible for the unforgivable switching shambles for which British Gas is entirely responsible. I have seen nothing to indicate that MSE facilitated this promotion with anything other than the best of intentions.

However . . . In view of the fact that a wealth of evidence abounds to suggest that British Gas has pretended, and is still pretending, to be "working together" with another company that doesn't actually exist, it's difficult to see how MSE can avoid commenting.

It might like to advise MSE members of their rights -- or otherwise -- to seek an adjudication from the Advertising Standards Authority.

It might like to enquire as to how many MSErs thought they were dealing with Sainsbury's rather than "a trading name of British Gas Trading Limited" when they signed up to this promotion.

It might like to make its own position crystal clear in regard to the practice of false-flagging and state whether it believes that what has happened here was by accident or by design.

MSE has never been backward about coming forward on the topic of mis-selling. I wouldn't expect it to be anything but its usual incisive self in regard to Sainsbury's Energy: Working together with British Gas . . .

canterswest

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/tips/28-01-2015/

There are several claims made by MSE when it promoted this deal that can be challenged now that consumers have experienced the offer and found it not to be as advertised.

If everyone whose deal has not worked out as promised complains to the ASA and it conducts an investigation and upholds the complaint, details of the adjudication are released to the press. If the press reports the adjudication, this will put pressure on MSE to compensate its customers for consumer detriment, at least hand back its commission as it has done with previous failed deals.

Dan's many emails on this thread demonstrate that MSE is at the very least joint promoter.

CAP Code which MSE as the advertiser has to comply with (claims by MSE it writes journalistic articles are rubbish, ignore them like the ASA does)

http://cap.org.uk/Advertising-Codes/Non-Broadcast.aspx

Hern

canterswest wrote: »

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/tips/28-01-2015/

There are several claims made by MSE when it promoted this deal that can be challenged now that consumers have experienced the offer and found it not to be as advertised.

If everyone whose deal has not worked out as promised complains to the ASA and it conducts an investigation and upholds the complaint, details of the adjudication are released to the press. If the press reports the adjudication, this will put pressure on MSE to compensate its customers for consumer detriment, at least hand back its commission as it has done with previous failed deals.

Dan's many emails on this thread demonstrate that MSE is at the very least joint promoter.

CAP Code which MSE as the advertiser has to comply with (claims by MSE it writes journalistic articles are rubbish, ignore them like the ASA does)

http://cap.org.uk/Advertising-Codes/Non-Broadcast.aspx

Thanks for that. It's certainly the case that this promotion isn't working out for far too many and that in some cases -- including mine -- none of the current stress and time wasting would ever have occurred if the English language had not been so deliberately finessed, as appears to be the case here. However: I blame British Gas for this. It is far too big a player not to know what it is doing.

Until I hear to the contrary, then, I have the feeling that everything MSE said about this promotion had to be pre-checked and pre-cleared by British Gas. Most telling is the phrase in that link you thoughtfully posted: The winner is the Sainsbury's Energy Discount Fixed Feb 2016 tariff (run by British Gas).

I did notice that, but the impression gained from that paragraph -- I'd submit, the only impression that could possibly be gained from that paragraph -- was that supermarket giant Sainsbury's had set up an energy supply division which had negotiated a deal with British Gas to supply MSErs with gas and electricity at a special rate. The tariff, the supply, and of course, the switching, would be overseen by Sainsbury's energy supply division, to which British Gas was the appointed contractor.

That is, of course, a complete fantasy.

Sainsbury's does not have an "energy division" -- even though British Gas is downright desperate for everyone to believe that it does (Sainsbury's Energy: Working Together with British Gas.) The MSE text quoted above should not have said "run by" but instead: Sainsbury's Energy Discount Fixed Feb 2016 tariff (from British Gas).

This is not a question of accidental semantics but one of deliberate perception management. "Run by" will, to any reasonable person, be a concomitant of the phrase "appointed to", such appointment in this case being the contractual appointment of British Gas to "run" a scheme originated by Sainsbury's Energy. We now know that no such scheme ever existed because we now know that Sainsbury's Energy does not exist.

Have to say, I do feel sorry for MSE on this one, not least because it is clear that MSE is doing a lot behind the scenes to get British Gas -- not Sainsbury's -- to sort out a mess that shows every sign of being self-created thanks to the energy giant's (a) under-estimation of demand and (b) the energy giant's seeming refusal to now allocate sufficient resource to contend with the consequences of that demand. British Gas certainly has enough money to do so. The conclusion, or so it appears to me, is that it is choosing not to out of a commercial imperative to minimize its promotional spend in order to maximize its promotional profits.

Meantime, this troubling business continues on. I have yet to be asked to supply an electricity meter reading. I have yet to be told when my electricity supply switch-over will be complete despite being assured in a letter dated February 13th that my switch was now being actioned.

I have yet to receive an answer to two separate emails which went through to the so-called "Sainsbury's Energy" complaints team despite my online account -- such as it is -- saying a technical error had obstructed the transmission of those complaints. I merely have emailed acknowledgments. But nothing else.

I am also still awaiting an acknowledgment from (again) the so-called "Sainsbury's Energy" complaints team to a Royal Mail Certified Special Delivery letter. I had hoped an email acknowledgment would've been issued for that, too, but evidently such is beyond British Gas's competence in customer care.

Thanks for the CAP guide link. I have a feeling that this saga has some distance to run yet.

_Kismet

Quick update on my situation, following my [post=68200760]previous post[/post].

For the benefit of a paper trail, I've emailed MSECollectiveswitch@sainsburysenergy.com about my incomplete switch (Gas switched but still waiting on Electricity).

I called OVO, who have been really helpful, and they've said they'll contact British Gas / Sainsbury's Energy to chase them up for a final reading so they can issue a final bill. I'm told I should give British Gas a couple of weeks.

Now, on the topic of "Sainsbury's Energy: Working together with British Gas", might I suggest to MSE that they merge the threads for [post=58955599]British Gas[/post] and Sainsbury's Energy given that Sainsbury's Energy is merely a front? Or at the very least, they should make this clear on the opening posts of those threads and cross-link the two threads?

The British Gas feedback thread has 12 posts and all are negative. This thread has 445. Either way, I don't think it's right for British Gas to escape negative feedback by hiding behind "Sainsbury's Energy".

anthony_is_still_waiting

Rant....Switched to Sainsbury's energy and my electricity went through within 4 weeks. Still waiting for gas to switch now some 8 weeks. Rang the customer service twice and still no joy, guess what they say they will ring back.....still waiting bad move on my part to go to Sainsbury's wish I stopped with EDF.


Anthony

anthony_is_still_waiting

Cheap energy club


"Helping you get no hassle"


Big joke...I am not laughing

Hern

anthony_is_still_waiting wrote: »

Rant....Switched to Sainsbury's energy and my electricity went through within 4 weeks. Still waiting for gas to switch now some 8 weeks. Rang the customer service twice and still no joy, guess what they say they will ring back.....still waiting bad move on my part to go to Sainsbury's wish I stopped with EDF. Anthony

You aren't with Sainsbury's. You are with an image-building fantasy conjured up by British Gas. Sainsbury's is a supermarket chain. Sainsbury's is not selling you a gas or an electricity supply. British Gas's slogan: Sainsbury's Energy: Working With British Gas is a misrepresentation of the truth.

If you're not sure who is supplying your gas, then have a word with your previous supplier. I have been able to establish, thanks to the kindness of mine, the dates when British Gas took on my supply. . . even though British Gas continues not to tell me anything at all.

Incidentally: why are you wasting your time on telephone calls and telephone conversations? Under the current Energy Ombudsman system, no energy customer can bring a complaint to it until a minimum of 8 weeks has passed from the time of the original complaint to the energy supplier.

Waiting the required 8 weeks from the time of an, um, telephone conversation is simply not the way to go about it. Telephone conversations can fail to be recorded, fail to be documented, fail to be actioned, fail to be even understood. All the energy companies know that, which is why it suits them mightily when consumers actually volunteer to spend needless hours on the end of a phone line.

You need to complain in writing. You need to post your written complaint by Royal Mail Special Delivery. After that? Sit back, and watch the weeks tick by. It's British Gas that needs to worry about the eventual outcome of all this. Not you.

Former_MSE_Archna

therealgiblet wrote: »

So MSE got their £2.7million from this promotion from the 90,000 customers who signed up.

:T Well done. I should imagine you're all very happy in the office.

Strange Martin hasn't mentioned anything about this complete disaster on this site or any of his other outlets that he regulary features on.

Makes me feel dirty that I got sucked in to this sham of a promotion.

Hope you guys are enjoying the champagne.

We are not happy with the problems either and have been putting pressure on Sainsbury's to resolve these issues. I would just like to correct you on one point though, as we have included it in the weekly email here: http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/tips/18-03-2015/ and wrote detailed information on how to get help here: http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/cheapenergyclub/helpquestions/.

Also do remember we give half of what a comparison site usually makes back to users in the way of cashback.

Can I check if you've been in touch with us about your problem? Can I ask you to PM me and I'll make sure it gets escalated and sorted.

Former_MSE_Archna

Hi all

I just wanted to respond to some of the queries here.

First of all, if you’re still having problems with the collective switch, please email collectiveswitch at moneysavingexpert dot com (please include your postcode and house number or account number). We will escalate each unresolved issue to Sainsbury’s/BG individually and track it to ensure it is resolved.

We are aware of the issues some people are experiencing and have been working hard behind the scenes to get Sainsbury’s/BG to take significant action.


We got around 60 call centre staff added to the team within a short time and from tests we’ve done, the call waiting times has reduced to five minutes.

We are talking to Sainsbury’s Energy/BG about the estimated bills and final bills and will post an update as soon as possible. If there are any other issues you are experiencing please do get in touch and let us know so we can help resolve them.

We are obviously not happy with the problems that Sainsbury’s/BG has had with the switching process and are giving it a hard time but the tariff is a good deal. We questioned suppliers in detail about their switching processes in advance of the auction and Sainsbury’s promised it would be able to cope with the demand. We also visited the call centre during the switch and delved into processes as much as we could.

Problems with switching happens across the board unfortunately –Npower, Co-op and Ovo have all had issues recently. From what we can tell the vast majority of switches have gone through, but please, please do get in touch with us so we can understand the issue and help resolve it.

MSE Archna