MSE News: Green Deal launches to help insulate homes

Ecodave

I broadly agree with you about not going door to door. I would never buy anything from door to door salesmen. On the other hand, many of the people who took up the offers of free insulation that was generally "sold" door to door, would never have heard of the offer otherwise.

grahamc2003

Ecodave wrote: »

The ultimate objective is to reduce co2 emissions. It's a nice bonus that lots of jobs will be created, but not a major goal. We need to reduce co2 emissions because of climate change. I don't really want to get into an argument about whether or not climate change is man made, it would take over the thread, and we wouldn't get anywhere. But even if you personally don't feel that climate change is a reality, the government does, and we are committed to reducing our emissions by certain deadlines. If we are to avoid massive fines, then we need to reduce co2 emissions.

So if you throw GD out of the window, then lets have something else on the table that can deliver the reductions in emissions.

If the goal is to reduce emissions, then it's implicit to reduce those emissions at the minimum cost, measured as Kg/£. Have you seen any analysis of various co2 reduction schemes and the reductions per pound spent, in order that the most efficient is chosen?

There are many sensible ways of reducing co2. The government may talk the talk, but how does their talk fit in with an absolutely massive gas fired power station construction which is on-going at the moment? Obviously, there are Gigatons of co2 could be save by building Nuclear power stations instead of gas. So much for co2 reduction being the major factor in any government decisions.

Another way of saving co2 very cheaply - simply capture the energy lost (very deliberately) in power station cooling towers. At a stroke, the amount of energy produced by a powerstation would be doubled. It's not done these days because it's not on the radar of those who drive energy policy.

Another easy co2 saving - simply give away electricity at night, when wholesale prices are very cheap due to a high Nuclear output, and shift demand away from daytime when electricity is very expensive due to being generated by the most inefficient and polluting powerstations.

There are many much cheaper ways of reducing co2 than the complex, expensive, manpower intensive system surrounding the green deal, where basically people will be begging for a loan because they'll be made to think the works they will be encouraged to do will be free.

My view on improving the housing stock will be to purely concentrate on the very high payback actions, and they should be supplied freely, from central funds. Things like hot water tank insulation - a few quid cost, probably recouped in less than a year. Probably the next quickest payback (to society) would be loft insulation followed by CVI. Only consider this low hanging fruit, and make it freely available. Encouraging people to dump perfectly good gas boilers because they're not as efficient as the latest models is the opposite of 'green', and is a very expensive way of cutting co2. I know you personally won't be advising such actions, but I expect those assessors working for BG with a £200 bonus resting on each replaced boiler may well do. (But that will never happen, will it?)

Ecodave

Not much I disagree with you there Graham. Couldn't believe the government chose not to commit to decarbonisation in the energy bill.
I think a lot of the low hanging insulation fruit has been picked, but remember there is still support for the vulnerable and low paid via ECO for loft and cavity insulation.

There are regulations in place to ensure assessors give appropriate advice, which of course, some assessors will break. They should be found out, there is a strict auditing process run by the regulating schemes, but what damage will have been done to homeowners in the meantime? Also, what damage will de done to the scheme overall if this happens? This might not be a concern to you, but as someone involved in the industry, I will inevitably get tarred by the same brush.

new_owner

As well as the above force all new builds to be as near passive as is possible to get. Set the costs on making better housing stock as opposed to cheap leaky boxes.

Invest in tidal energy and remove the need for polluting the country for the next 100,000 years with nuclear.

Stop funding wind farms which are at best a waste and worse a eye sore in some of the uk's most visually stunning areas.

The list goes on...

Richie-from-the-Boro

Wind .. .. another taxpayer transfer emissions scam, just like the Green Deal'.

- two brothers David and the numptie sibling Ed, it was Ed that agreed the scheme
- but it was the CONdems that put it into motion in March 2 years ago
- energy bills consistently hiked thanks to a series of dodgy wind energy contracts 'Gummered' through the corridors of power
- taxpayers money, draining away on wind contracts while most households posting here are pushed to the limit
- £17 billion of your money stacked in the favour of turbine manufacturers
- Maggie Hodge was right describing the situation as a money printing ‘license for the private sector
- the energy department has reluctantly admitted they will have to ‘re-examine some of the terms’
- but the energy department cant see how taxpayers can avoid having to stump up for DECC’s failings

Ring a loud bell does it ?

- the government need another 15% of wind energy, that's about £8 billion of infrastructure investment they don't have

Hang on .. .. if we stop supplying free etc 'low hanging fruit' and get the Green Deal' off to a good start by conning the public .. .. again. By the time we need that £8 billion a lot of revenue will have been saved.

Ring a loud bell does it ?

So they awarded an opportunity and the industry took it with both hands and wrested control completely from government and now that the government know the taxpayers are being robbed for wind they say they "cant see how taxpayers can avoid having to stump up for DECC’s failings" In ten years time the Green Deal will be the same con on the public.

If anyone reading this thinks the 'Green Deal' is a good idea, you go for it my friends its your right.

The day may come in the not too distant future when nuclear will be the only 'greenest' workable supply of carbon-free energy source to the fast-growing world population, that requires a huge shift in human thinking and will take many years, all the current and proposed new carbon [fracking] & non carbon systems are a minute drop in the ocean in terms of current needs let alone future needs. Until that day arrives we should be putting money and effort into the one thing we can do .. .. insulation, the preserving heat & comfort we have already used the worlds resources to generate and have already paid dearly for.

That the Green Deal is here and does not work is a great sadness to me, its the one thing we could and should be doing every single day since its inception, and ........................... nothing - not a sausage, many thousands robbed of a couple of hundred quid for an already mouldering assessment by ex double glazing salesman to get on the ladder only to find out that all rungs after the first rung have been removed from the ladder.

Canucklehead

Anyone seen any further news on this?

Richie-from-the-Boro

Canucklehead wrote: »

Anyone seen any further news on this?

- not further news as such, but it's here in this thread
- it's the fact that all current 'Green Deal Golden Rules' so heavily sold in this thread
- should be fundamentally questioned by anyone before taking in the sales spiel

geoffky

Ecodave,True..... There is nothing i can do as they are both sat on some beach for a month as we speak...I found out as i went to see them before they went away...

I will guarantee you one thing..Once you find that you get far more sales using your silver tongue you will walk down that path....And we all know what happens gradually...

Richie-from-the-Boro

- the lies and deceit has started already
- nice young fella knocks my door - leaflet - my boro council name on it clearly 'sponsoring' the seller
- no charge at all he says when I ask is it completely free as this leaflet says in big red letters

I rang the my boro council, after two hours they ring back and assure me they sponsor no one in the town, and asked for information from the leaflet.

I rang the leaflet number, after 7 goes at waffle he admitted its not free but paid back with interest, the bill transferred to the dwelling if sold.

- the lies and deceit has started already, how many poor, confused old and vulnerable will have signed before March arrives
- reading this ? - take care of your parents grandparents, and children
- the lies and deceit has started already

Arthur_Crown

Part of the Green Deal and ECO scheme is called Affordable Warmth. I believe this starts at the end of March this year. If you are on certain benefits you can qualify for a replacement gas boiler if your existing boiler isn't working properly.go to 'affordablewarmthapply'