John Lewis refusing to refund..help please

marlowtech

Please could someone suggest the right way forward on this.

We ordered a large canvas print from John Lewis over the internet which arrived and is not suitable. We called them to arrange returning it and they said as it was "made to order" we could not return it.

We checked the website and it says "Please note: As this item is made to order it is non-refundable. This service is exclusive to John Lewis online." This text is at the bottom of the page in normal type. We did not see it. There is no other warning during the order process that you cannot return the item.

We then checked our order confirmation which stated :

What happens next?

You can return your items for any reason up to 28 days after delivery. Further information can be found in the customer service section of our website and the despatch note included with your order. Please note that John Lewis Direct will bear the cost of returning the products.

There is no other mention of not being able to return the item unless it is made to the customer's specification (or underwear etc etc). There are only 3 sizes of this print available (small, medium, large) and to my own mind, this does not constitute being made to our specfication. If we had specified an exact size then I would completely agree that it was made to order. They are also showing that they have 10 items in stock.

We called customer services and the agent (after speaking with her superviser) agreed to give us back the money as vouchers. We asked for a refund to our credit card and the customer services rep spoke to her manager again who then refused to refund us anything! Not even vouchers.

Please can you advise what we should do next.

I am most surprised at this attitude from John Lewis.

Thanks in advance...

hollydays

I am afraid that if it was on the site and you missed it,there is nothing you can do.Bit surprised they made you an offer (at all), then withdrew it,but I can only suggest you ask customer services why a supervisor authorized this,then withdrew it.Calls are probably recorded.
Offering to refund goods that when you have just changed your mind is an extra service companies offer,as an extra service to customers,but its not an automatic legal right.

If they say they are made to order,they are made to order-what benefit would there be in saying this if it wasnt the case?

dmg24

Yep, hollydays is right, even though it only stated it once, it did clearly state that the item was non returnable. Therefore you cannot rely on the Distance Selling Regulations.

marlowtech

hollydays wrote: »

I am afraid that if it was on the site and you missed it,there is nothing you can do.Bit surprised they made you an offer (at all), then withdrew it,but I can only suggest you ask customer services why a supervisor authorized this,then withdrew it.Calls are probably recorded.
Offering to refund goods that when you have just changed your mind is an extra service companies offer,as an extra service to customers,but its not an automatic legal right.

Thanks for this - but I thought under distance selling rules you normally had 28 days anyway?

woohoo_postingid

When you say it is 'not suitable', do you mean it is different to what you ordered or simply that you don't like it?

marlowtech

woohoo_postingid wrote: »

When you say it is 'not suitable', do you mean it is different to what you ordered or simply that you don't like it?

Simply don't like it!

I appreciate all your comments...even if they don't help me! I thought that because the order acknowledgement said that you had 28 days that we were covered.

LittleVoice

"Cooling off" period can't apply if during that time they have begun work on or completed a made to order product.

marlowtech

LittleVoice wrote: »

"Cooling off" period can't apply if during that time they have begun work on or completed a made to order product.

I completely understand this and agree. My argument is that this is not made to order as they've got 10 in stock, and they are not made to specification as they've only got 3 sizes (s,m,l) to choose from.

My other point is that it seems slightly against the spirit of JL customer service to have at the bottom of the page the standard web page the warning (in exactly the same font size etc), and then no further mention of it - indeed an email stating the exact opposite (ie that the goods can be returned at JL's expense).

Thanks for all your help with this...

Optimist

The DSR do state that personalised goods or goods made to a consumer's specification cannot be returned and as you have stated they have 10 in stock one has to wonder how it has been personalised or made to your specification. Unless of course they keep them unframed and just frame it at the time of order in which case I suggest you hang it and enjoy it!

They cant by just putting it in their T@Cs change your rights under law. Its worth asking them the question how they have personalised it ?

marlowtech

Optimist wrote: »

The DSR do state that personalised goods or goods made to a consumer's specification cannot be returned and as you have stated they have 10 in stock one has to wonder how it has been personalised or made to your specification. Unless of course they keep them unframed and just frame it at the time of order in which case I suggest you hang it and enjoy it!

They cant by just putting it in their T@Cs change your rights under law. Its worth asking them the question how they have personalised it ?

Thanks for this - I'll call them and let you know what they say...

stugib

marlowtech wrote: »

We checked the website and it says "Please note: As this item is made to order it is non-refundable. This service is exclusive to John Lewis online."
....
There are only 3 sizes of this print available (small, medium, large) and to my own mind, this does not constitute being made to our specfication. If we had specified an exact size then I would completely agree that it was made to order. They are also showing that they have 10 items in stock.

Actually, all might not be lost, though you'll have to fight it. My first post to MSE was about a case I'd ordered for my PDA which, to cut a long story short, was completely misdescribed but because they said it was made to order I couldn't send it back.

However, Consumer Direct's opinion was that as there was only so many variations they sold, it was pretty obvious they mass produced the case to different proportions/colours, albeit probably ~100 different variations, so they couldn't claim it was custom-made and get out of the DSR through it. It seems similar to your case where there's only 3 variations and they have stock in. Have you asked them in what way they consider it to be custom-made?

I did forward my complaints to trading standards but never heard back from them, and my indignation at being ripped off waned to a point where it wasn't worth chasing for the £15 I'd lost, so what Consumer Direct told me was never decided one way or the other.