schools opening when it has snowed!

daisiegg

johnnyl wrote: »

The school has to make sure its operation and any risks it induces are managed and managing risk isnt about not doing things but how to do things in the safest way. Anyone who shuts a school on the grounds of what you say quite simply does not understand risk assessment. They participate in tick box versions that are used to justify a decision that has already been made. That isnt risk assessment, it is @rse covering and nothing more. It pretty much the same as those who think that you can send someone to do a very hazardous job just because we have writen an RA for it. Neither are worth the paper they are written on if the person doing it doesnt understand how to quantify then manage risk.

But not everyone is such an expert on risk assessment as you. What do you think the reaction would be if a head went against the 'tick box risk assessment' and then something DID happen? Do you really think the insurance company, the local authority, the governors and everyone else the head teacher has to answer to would accept the argument of 'yeah but I thought the tick box risk assessment was stupid so I went against it and did my own REAL risk assessment'.

Unfortunately, in this litigious age, people in positions of responsibility DO have to cover their backs (no need for vulgarity ) Teachers and head teachers have not created the system, but they do have to work within it.

tom9980

johnnyl wrote: »

Shutting the school does not eliminate those risks or protect those people from what you have mentioned because they will still be somewhere with them with exactly the same challenges in getting the emergency services there. In essence, you have achieved nothing by doing it.

Really? are you sure?

1 Adult looking after their own children which will likely be 1-5 at most or 1 maybe 2 adults per 30 children? do you still think the risk is the same?

misiek404

johnnyl wrote: »

attempted smart replies aside, has anyone got an answer to the question posed.

If it is a common view then is it likely to be a common view without any merit. If so, why is it common?

It's quite common among bad parents actually. People who tend to shift their own responsibilities onto others.
I work across variety of schools and, with very few exceptions, I find teachers very dedicated people with lots of passion for what they do, whose efforts are being constantly wasted by bad parenting. The problem I keep seeing is that teachers shout at children too much, where really they should be shouting at parents when they come to pick up their kids at the end of the day.

silvercar

A nursery school near here opened yesterday, staff able to get in so no reason to stay shut. he adjacent car park is owned by a different organisation and decded for H&S to remain shut. So nursery open, car park shut. Nursery is situated on a sharp bend of quiet road. At least quiet until 40-60 parents descend and try and park on crowded and icy street. Two bumps that I witnessed. Both the nursery and the car park owners had done their risk assessments. Result-= chaos

Pennywise

silvercar wrote: »

Both the nursery and the car park owners had done their risk assessments. Result-= chaos

No, the nursery hadn't done it's risk assessment properly - it hadn't assessed the risk of the car park being closed and the chaos that the closure would obviously cause. Risk isn't restricted within the boundaries of their own premises. It sounds like their risk assessment, was merely a backside covering assessment to avoid themselves being caught for compensation if something happened. Absolutely no regard for other associated risks!

Sounds like they merely "assumed" the car park would be open and we all know what happens when people make assumptions without checking the facts. They may not be the cause of the accidents and chaos but they clearly could have avoided the problems.

Janepig

Got a text from school this morning at about 10.30am to say the school was closing - there wasn't a flake when I dropped them off, but where I work it was pretty bad in some areas (although the main roads were fine) and a large number of schools in that LEA were closed.

The result of DD/DS's school (and others) closing mid morning was traffic carnage due to the usual heavy school run traffic all trying to make their way through a blizzard which had developed, treacherous driving conditions, which incidentally, has now all cleared, as predicted in the weather forecast. I've never been so glad to make it home safely, but imo they put more children/staff/parents at risk by taking the decision to close than if they'd have kept them there until 3pm when it looks like it'll all be fine. There have been several road accidents though, including one that must have happened near the school literally just behind me as they were mentioning it on the radio as I was still driving back home with the children.

Not forgetting that I don't get paid when I'm not in work and because I had to leave I've also left my colleagues short staffed. Annoyed doesn't even begin to cover it.

Jx

maryjanell79

This happened to me last week! So annoying I called up the school office the day before it snowed really badly and asked them "Are you sure your opening tomorrow, as I will need to let work know or arrange childcare" the response I got was yes yes of course we will be open.

I didn't like the idea of my daughter going to school in this weather but kept my opinion to myself on the subject! She was in school for 2 hours and then they sent them home! :mad:

I had to find someone to pick her up as I was the only one at work that day, annoys me how schools don't fully consider working families when they do this!

Rant over!

thegirlintheattic

maryjanell79 wrote: »

This happened to me last week! So annoying I called up the school office the day before it snowed really badly and asked them "Are you sure your opening tomorrow, as I will need to let work know or arrange childcare" the response I got was yes yes of course we will be open.

I didn't like the idea of my daughter going to school in this weather but kept my opinion to myself on the subject! She was in school for 2 hours and then they sent them home! :mad:

I had to find someone to pick her up as I was the only one at work that day, annoys me how schools don't fully consider working families when they do this!

Rant over!

Dammed it they do and dammed if they don't. In local primaries parents arrive anyway when it starts snowing asking to collect kids. If the schools close some parents complain, if the schools stay open others will complain about having to go out in bad snow or worry about the kids getting stranded. If the school preempts it and closes before school starts then parents complain that school is closed.

johnnyl

Pennywise wrote: »

No, the nursery hadn't done it's risk assessment properly - it hadn't assessed the risk of the car park being closed and the chaos that the closure would obviously cause. Risk isn't restricted within the boundaries of their own premises. It sounds like their risk assessment, was merely a backside covering assessment to avoid themselves being caught for compensation if something happened. Absolutely no regard for other associated risks!

Sounds like they merely "assumed" the car park would be open and we all know what happens when people make assumptions without checking the facts. They may not be the cause of the accidents and chaos but they clearly could have avoided the problems.

AT LAST !!!!

Somebody who actually understands the subject. That is exactly it, the piece of paper achieves nothing. All they had to do is assess and then remove the risk.

johnnyl

tom9980 wrote: »

Really? are you sure?

1 Adult looking after their own children which will likely be 1-5 at most or 1 maybe 2 adults per 30 children? do you still think the risk is the same?

however my comments were talking about an emergency situation. If it is an ES and you are relying on the emergency services it really doesnt matter if the child is at home, out playing or in school. These services have the same challenges getting there.

All I would expect a school to do, is not to add unecessary risks rather than to shut up shop on these grounds. Think of it this way, from an emergency services perspective the schools risks arent unique at all and in fact there are many other places who dont close but would have a better justification to do so on the grounds of ES access.