schools opening when it has snowed!

johnnyl

do you know what is quite interesting with this lot, after hearing all this "legal requirement" bobbins I thought for a minute that there might be some merit in it. That is until a very quick google search on ratios and requirements yield that beyond KS1 there are no legal requirements whatsoever for staff ratios. Have a few people been telling porkies per chance? :rotfl::rotfl:

so that is anyone above the age of 6 is it? or 7? No ratios?

Valli

Well you found us out. The kids can be in school with NO ADULT supervision whatsoever.


Actually; what you have discovered is that, in KS1, classes cannot have more than 30 pupils per teacher. That's all.

thegirlintheattic

johnnyl wrote: »

do you know what is quite interesting with this lot, after hearing all this "legal requirement" bobbins I thought for a minute that there might be some merit in it. That is until a very quick google search on ratios and requirements yield that beyond KS1 there are no legal requirements whatsoever for staff ratios. Have a few people been telling porkies per chance? :rotfl::rotfl:

so that is anyone above the age of 6 is it? or 7? No ratios?

You are either talking about maximum infant class sizes which is 30 children per class or EYFS supervision which is 2:26.

johnnyl

Valli wrote: »

Well you found us out. The kids can be in school with NO ADULT supervision whatsoever.


Actually; what you have discovered is that, in KS1, classes cannot have more than 30 pupils per teacher. That's all.

correct, and there is no limit above KS2

So does this ratio actually exist and what is it. I appreciate that class size and total ratio are perhaps different things, so what is the ratio limit and is this limit set in stone or open to manouver in extreme circumstances.

Janepig

Valli wrote: »

Well you found us out. The kids can be in school with NO ADULT supervision whatsoever.


Actually; what you have discovered is that, in KS1, classes cannot have more than 30 pupils per teacher. That's all.

Not entirely correct, there are exceptions, and in DS's class (year 2) there are 34 children.

DD/DS's school closes when about 5 snowflakes fall on the roof of the school and yes I do get a bit cross about it because, for instance, last Friday I would have been able to get to work, twelve miles away (DH did), despite the snow we had, but I had to stay home as the school had closed and DD/DS needed looking after. For which I didn't get paid. Did the teachers get paid? Hmmmmmm, I wonder? I also wonder, how much more keen they would be to make it into work if they weren't going to be paid? Hmmmmmmm.

I haven't read the whole thread so don't know if it's been mentioned, but I read something today about how the register is marked when the school has to be closed due to snow (or if it stays open but some pupils can't get in because of the weather) and there's a letter they use to mark against the names (can't remember what it is) which doesn't show up when inspectors are looking at levels of absence at each particular school. Sorry if this has already been covered.

Jx

thegirlintheattic

Janepig wrote: »

Not entirely correct, there are exceptions, and in DS's class (year 2) there are 34 children.

DD/DS's school closes when about 5 snowflakes fall on the roof of the school and yes I do get a bit cross about it because, for instance, last Friday I would have been able to get to work, twelve miles away (DH did), despite the snow we had, but I had to stay home as the school had closed and DD/DS needed looking after. For which I didn't get paid. Did the teachers get paid? Hmmmmmm, I wonder? I also wonder, how much more keen they would be to make it into work if they weren't going to be paid? Hmmmmmmm.

I haven't read the whole thread so don't know if it's been mentioned, but I read something today about how the register is marked when the school has to be closed due to snow (or if it stays open but some pupils can't get in because of the weather) and there's a letter they use to mark against the names (can't remember what it is) which doesn't show up when inspectors are looking at levels of absence at each particular school. Sorry if this has already been covered.

Jx

Infant Class Size: Very rare to go over 30 unless there are two teachers. It is a legal requirement. There are a few permitted exceptions such as SEN or if there is not other school place available. This limit is about the quality of teaching and learning, not safe supervision.

It's a Y.

As for pay, if the school closes teachers are paid but expected to work from home (marking, creating lessons etc.). If the school is not closed teachers are not paid if they do not make it in. There is a lot of pressure on teachers to make it in, even when police are advising against it.

johnnyl

Taken from the NUT

HEALTH, SAFETY AND WELFARE CONSIDERATIONS

Supervision Ratios

There are no minimum pupil/staff supervision ratios laid down in law. The DfES advises that the numbers of staff (teachers or midday supervisors as appropriate) on duty at any one time should be determined according to the results of a risk assessment which takes into account the ages and abilities of the children and the geographical features of the school. The considerations here are based on health and safety law and the ratios must be in line with the minimum requirements necessary to ensure that children are safely supervised at all times

Looks like some people have been talking an inordinate amount of bobbins.

oh dear oh dear


and by the way, the supervision guidance (not law, guidance) is 1 to 75 for midday supervision. To put this into context, for Mariscos school of 800 kids, given that class sizes will be 30ish, there will be roughly 30 teachers (or more) of which 10 only have to show up to meet the 1 to 75 guidance. Thats right, only 1 in 3 would have to roll up. How lame that this can not be achieved.

bwa ha ha ha

gregg1

johnnyl wrote: »

Ive pointed it out to you now. Care to explain why 20% of the teaching proffesion is off and if any other proffesion has this level of no show.

Teachers wonder why this attitude prevails, it is because they have earned it. It really is that straightforward.

I have no desire to argue with you but I do have to ask the question. If the county council or the head of the school decide not to open the school (in the case of my OH's school the county council made a decision to do blanket closures, because the coach companies were not operating/they did not want kids stranded at school later in the day as the weather got worse). How can you then hold teachers responsible for decisions which are completely out of their control?

Or is there another reason why you seem so keen to lay the blame for this with teachers?

johnnyl

thegirlintheattic wrote: »

Infant Class Size: Very rare to go over 30 unless there are two teachers. It is a legal requirement. There are a few permitted exceptions such as SEN or if there is not other school place available. This limit is about the quality of teaching and learning, not safe supervision.
.

thats funny, 4 pages ago it was a legal requirement

mrcow

johnnyl wrote: »

yes, we know, everyone can fiond one example. Ive challenged you to find a proffesion that was 20% closed. There isnt one.

My husband's company (banking sector) postponed 100% of their upgrades over the weekend - costing the company thousands.

Reason - the snow.