Flight delay and cancellation compensation, KLM/AF ONLY

visidigi

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81997580#Comment_81997580

They are saying this:

Upon reinvestigation, it was determined that although the disruption involved a missed connection, the total delay between the originally scheduled arrival time and the actual arrival time was less than three hours; therefore, compensation is not applicable, nor can any further compensatory or goodwill gesture be offered in this matter.

In the request to relook at it (they have sent this response twice now) I attached the flight aware screenshots of the two flights I actually traveled, including showing the LOT flight arrived late.

They have provided no proof or information in relation to their calculations, nor have the attempted to say its extraordinary.

eskbanker

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81997595#Comment_81997595

Difficult to understand what they're arguing from that, but I wonder if their use of 'total' delay signifies that they're trying to argue that two small flight delays don't add up to one of over three hours? If that is what they're asserting, it would contravene case law which supports your position that it's the delay between originally scheduled versus actual arrival at your final destination, as per Air France v Folkerts (case C-11/11):

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:62011CJ0011

Caz3121

I expect KLM is looking at the scheduled arrival of the flight they booked you on - 2135 which is less than 3 hours after your original scheduled arrival of 1846….probably thought they were off the hook for compensation when they booked you on that…

the second delay on LOT is what pushed your overall delay over 3 hours…I wonder if they will argue that x amount of time was outside of their control….what was the reason for the delay on the LOT flight?

visidigi

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81998276#Comment_81998276

Late inbound aircraft (not sure of reason) and then…Schiphol - apparently there was some war memorial on the day which they all stop working for 10-30 minutes - some of the ground crew stopped, others didn't but it was widely known it was going to happen as the KLM transfer desk told me not to bother switching onto the next KLM WAW flight (it was departing 10 mins after the LOT was due) because 'it will be delayed' - due to the memorial. So everyone knew it would be late, but they didn't adjust the schedules for it (frankly, not my problem right?).

If KLM are trying to say they can't be held accountable for the other carrier delay then that's again not my problem right - I got in at 2220 - they can't ignore the fact I arrived late just because it suits…and I got lucky, the 10 minute later flight to WAW on KLM didn't get in till 2330

visidigi

For those that are interested…

I ended up in deadlock with KLM, they refused to engage any further, so the email saying final decision was all I needed.

28/05/2026 Took it to the ADR process (free, easy, useful) and they immediately processed it through to KLM. Day before defense due KLM asked for an extension.

20/07/2026 New day of defense due KLM told ADR that they shouldn't have accepted my claim. ADR reviewed and said there was no reason to stop claim.

04/08/2026 KLM again failed to file defense. ADR took it to adjudication.

28/09/2026 Found in my favour for valid claim. KLM accepted outcome - I'm now awaiting payment.

Case law referenced in decision: Sturgeon v Condor (C-402/07): Passengers delayed by 3 or more hours at their final destination have the same
compensation rights as passengers on cancelled flights. This landmark ruling established delay compensation under
UK261.

Airline Feedback in decision: The Airline has advised the reason for the delay was due to the unavailability of loading equipment which was within the Airlines control.

So it takes a while, KLM wasted so many people time when it was obvious. But at least it was settled in the end.

eskbanker

The forthcoming revisions to the regulations incorporate plenty of case law and clarify the situation to explicitly include total journeys rather than individual flights, three hour delays, missed connections, definitions of extraordinary circumstances, etc, as well as claims processing deadlines, so hopefully such claims will be simpler in future:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6681216/revised-eu261-rules-for-implementation-mid-to-late-2027