Flight delay and cancellation compensation, KLM/AF ONLY

Hairy_Hogg

Hairy_Hogg wrote: »

Hi all, I am currently in 'negotiation' with Air France.

August 2010 I had a flight from London - Paris - Bogota and then a return a week later on the same route, all business class.

There was a delay on the Paris to Bogota route on the way out as follows:

"flight delayed by 3 hours and 29 minutes after the aircraft returned to the parking stand due a technical issue with the angle of attack probe. A further delay was caused by the flight deck crew having reached the statutory work deadline and no alternative crew was available to operate the flight."

However Air France are saying "In both cases the crew had performed all the necessary checks and the aircraft were cleared to depart. The problems occurred shortly after the aircraft had pushed back from the stand and were therefore unexpected and entirely unforeseen. These are not situations where we can offer compensation according to EU Regulation 261"

On the way home the flight from Bogota to Paris was cancelled due to:

"returned to the parking stand shortly after pushback from the terminal after a problem of overheating was discovered in one of the engines"

They did not have the correct part to fix it so we were sent to a hotel and returned to the airport 24 hours later to get a flight, however we negotiated a flight via AF with Iberia as we were not sure they would fix the flight.

So far I have been offered a €600 flight voucher for the 24hour delayed return (as an act of good will as 'We confirm that the circumstances which caused this delay are considered 'extraordinary' according to the European Union regulation. As a result, I must respectfully decline your request to pay compensation. ') to use within 12 months. I went back and said I was not happy and would like a partial refund of the ticket price but was told that as I had accepted an alternative flight that would not happen however they would also credit 30,000 miles to my account

I have just gone back to them stating that I would like my compensation which I believe to €600 + €300 for the two times delay as a minimum please. All very civil and polite.

Am I on the right track please? Can I insist on cash not flight vouchers and should I also pursue the cost of the return ticket?

TIA for any pointers.

So, a lady from Air France left a very weird message on my home phone answer machine essentially saying "We have offered all we are going to so if you are not happy then your only option is legal."

Can someone (Centipede100 ) kindly review the above and tell me that it is a good idea to go forwards with an MCOL claim based on the facts I have put above. I think I am on solid ground but do not want to lose a €592 flight voucher if I am not. Thanks.

romanby1

Hairy_Hogg wrote: »

So, a lady from Air France left a very weird message on my home phone answer machine essentially saying "We have offered all we are going to so if you are not happy then your only option is legal."

Can someone (Centipede100 ) kindly review the above and tell me that it is a good idea to go forwards with an MCOL claim based on the facts I have put above. I think I am on solid ground but do not want to lose a €592 flight voucher if I am not. Thanks.

Hang on to the voucher and insist in a NBA letter on the full value of your claim or you will go to court. They have in effect admitted the claim and are trying to reduce their losses.

Hairy_Hogg

romanby1 wrote: »

Hang on to the voucher and insist in a NBA letter on the full value of your claim or you will go to court. They have in effect admitted the claim and are trying to reduce their losses.

They are saying go to court, I stated that would be my next course of action and they responded with the phone message.

I just need to know if people think that I have a reasonable chance of success if I do.

Mr_Stroopwafel

Centipede100 wrote: »

For denied boarding and a subsequent delay under 4 hrs on a flight exceeding 3500 kms then the compensation can indeed be reduced by 50% to 300 euros.

Reply from KLM:

Thank you for your recent communication regarding the disruption to your flight ****. I am sorry for any inconvenience this situation may have caused you.

Your flight was cancelled as a result of on-going maintenance. After the cancellation was identified, it was necessary in order to rectify the situation, by re-booking your flights with ***. In the meantime; all appropriate measures were taken in order to offer you the best possible care and assistance.
According to EU recommendations, airline passengers are entitled to compensation in case of delays longer than 3 hours - unless the delay was caused by extraordinary circumstances over which we could not exercise any influence.

We have carefully considered your request and taken into account all relevant details for the delay in your arrival into ***.

Consequently, we confirm that the delay to the flight in question was less than 3 hours and so I must respectively decline your request for legal compensation. This is in accordance with the European Union regulation.

Thank you for allowing us this opportunity to explain our position in this matter. I do hope that we will have an early opportunity to service your travel needs again in the future.

---

Normally I wouldn't mind too much about this compensation, but I am more annoyed at the fact that staff told us they knew about this more than 24 hours beforehand but didn't let us know so we could make alternative plans. So am going to try and get the compensation for the delay.

However I was wondering how I respond to this, ie. how to refer to that the compensation is reduced by 50% in this case, since the delay was under 3 hours (by only 20 mins I might add.)

Thank you

Caz3121

from your previous post you said the flight was overbooked and you were put onto another flight (denied boarding) so was this not the case

There is no compensation for a delay of less than 3 hours

Mr_Stroopwafel

Caz3121 wrote: »

from your previous post you said the flight was overbooked and you were put onto another flight (denied boarding) so was this not the case

There is no compensation for a delay of less than 3 hours

I thought that there is, it's just reduced by 50%. I've seen it here,

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/air_travel/compensation_for_overbooked_and_delayed_flights.html#Compensati

and Centipede100 also believes that there is?

Caz3121

but you said your flight was over 3500km - nothing in that article that I can see that shows less than 3 hours for flights over 3500lm

Mr_Stroopwafel

Caz3121 wrote: »

but you said your flight was over 3500km - nothing in that article that I can see that shows less than 3 hours for flights over 3500lm

In the compensation section, table for "Compensation when re-routed", All other flights row (so over 3500km), 4 hours or less - 300 EUR ?

It's also here I think, The compensation will be reduced by 50% if the replacement flight does not exceed the scheduled arrival time:
http://www.airpassengerrights.co.uk/Rerouted.aspx

I'm just trying to find the best way to word it, can't really link to a random website when writing to them.

Caz3121

understand now. Was your original flight cancelled or were you denied boarding? (to help word the response, you originally said your flight was overbooked but the response you got seems to imply it was cancelled)

Mr_Stroopwafel

Caz3121 wrote: »

understand now. Was your original flight cancelled or were you denied boarding? (to help word the response, you originally said your flight was overbooked but the response you got seems to imply it was cancelled)

I thought it was overbooked, it wasn't made very clear at the airport but yes you're right from their response it implies it was cancelled.

I've sent them a response anyway, managed to find the text of the EU regulations and it's written quite clearly in there that compensation is reduced by 50% as mentioned. Thanks for the help, I'll keep everyone posted.