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USA Warns Cameron not to leave EU
Comments
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I notice the Storm Troopers have now waded in to tell us how bad it will be for our economy too. BBC Text Service "german MPS say it will be detrimental to its (UK) economy" .
All it needs is an apostrophe and they may be right"If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
And the reality will be what? If Europe doesn't get its act together, it'll end up being carved up between the new economic world powers in the same way that Europe once carved up Africa.
Too many people don't have the imagination to see that it's not our automatic right to be top dog, like we're born superior or something.
I meant the reality the the UK is not going to join a federal European state any time soon, and that it cannot continue to be treated as if it were part of such a state after it is formed.
All the scare stories are very comparable with those that were put about when we declined to join the Euro. We're vastly better off out of it and we will be vastly better off to revert our relationship with the forthcoming United States of Europe to a free trade pact.No-one would remember the Good Samaritan if he'd only had good intentions. He had money as well.
The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money.
Margaret Thatcher0 -
Indeed. Cameron must thump the table until he gets this free trade pact. He could threaten to stay until we get it.GeorgeHowell wrote: »We're vastly better off out of it and we will be vastly better off to revert our relationship with the forthcoming United States of Europe to a free trade pact.You might as well ask the Wizard of Oz to give you a big number as pay a Credit Referencing Agency for a so-called 'credit-score'0 -
Indeed. Cameron must thump the table until he gets this free trade pact. He could threaten to stay until we get it.
Nice one.
But by the time a new treaty is put up Milliband could be in No 10, and then we'd be back to doing everything that Germany and France tell us on the pretext of not getting "isolated".No-one would remember the Good Samaritan if he'd only had good intentions. He had money as well.
The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money.
Margaret Thatcher0 -
Graham_Devon wrote: »I;ve heard this stated before, and even a pro EU commentator said this was a mere scare tactic, as while we would have no free trade, the EU countries we trade with would be cutting their nose off to spite their face.
It's not a scare tactic. It's against EU rules for a consignment of widgets from Newcastle to be inspected by other EU authorities other than for reasons of security, smuggling etc. If a widget is made in Newcastle it meets EU standards - no question. This is essentially why we joined the EU.Graham_Devon wrote: »As much as we need to sell our goods, the reason people buy our goods right now is because they cannot get the same item with the same quality, characteristics and price somewhere else. They may be able to get an inferior, or better version, but that's not the same thing. If they could buy these things elsewhere for the same price or cheaper, why are they not doing so? This argument relies on trying to convince the EU sceptic that the EU is just being darn nice to us and buying our goods to do us a favour.
With the best will in the world our goods would become just that little bit more difficult to buy, customers will need slightly bigger stockholdings to deal with the longer leadtimes, they'll have to form relationships with port authorities (who are jobsworth nightmares), the extra admin will cost just that little bit more. If you're a carmaker looking to drive sales in the EU by building a factory - maybe Belgium starts to look that little bit more attractive. Are these little incremental hassles significant - I don't know.Graham_Devon wrote: »Theres 2 sides to every story, and it seems many only want to concentrate on the UK side, and tell us how bad it will be for us when we can't export, however, no one seems to care to even reference how this may damage those reliant on our goods.
It's a compelling argument, certainly. I'm just not convinced...at the moment.
I'm not pro-EU by any means - that said I'm surprised that the tone has changed so quickly - I thought the UK wanted to change the EU from within to an efficient and vibrant trading body and slow the march to federalism. Leaving the EU would limit our influence - again does it matter - don't know.
Some countries (France) might well be delighted to see the back of us - why? Is our national interest served by doing what France wants? You have to ask yourself whether it's better to try and influence the direction of Europe from inside or outside the EU.0 -
So apart from that objection, you think my idea is a runner?GeorgeHowell wrote: »Nice one.
But by the time a new treaty is put up Milliband could be in No 10, and then we'd be back to doing everything that Germany and France tell us on the pretext of not getting "isolated".You might as well ask the Wizard of Oz to give you a big number as pay a Credit Referencing Agency for a so-called 'credit-score'0 -
So apart from that objection, you think my idea is a runner?
It could be, because if Cameron vetoed their federalisation treaty until and unless he got the concessions and opt outs (difficult to imagine in the face of rabid opposition from just about everybody, except for his own party and the majority of the electorate) they would probably be glad to see us out rather than see the federal/German hegemony dream stall.No-one would remember the Good Samaritan if he'd only had good intentions. He had money as well.
The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money.
Margaret Thatcher0 -
It's not a scare tactic. It's against EU rules for a consignment of widgets from Newcastle to be inspected by other EU authorities other than for reasons of security, smuggling etc. If a widget is made in Newcastle it meets EU standards - no question. This is essentially why we joined the EU.
With the best will in the world our goods would become just that little bit more difficult to buy, customers will need slightly bigger stockholdings to deal with the longer leadtimes, they'll have to form relationships with port authorities (who are jobsworth nightmares), the extra admin will cost just that little bit more. If you're a carmaker looking to drive sales in the EU by building a factory - maybe Belgium starts to look that little bit more attractive. Are these little incremental hassles significant - I don't know.
I'm not pro-EU by any means - that said I'm surprised that the tone has changed so quickly - I thought the UK wanted to change the EU from within to an efficient and vibrant trading body and slow the march to federalism. Leaving the EU would limit our influence - again does it matter - don't know.
Some countries (France) might well be delighted to see the back of us - why? Is our national interest served by doing what France wants? You have to ask yourself whether it's better to try and influence the direction of Europe from inside or outside the EU.
Germany doesn't want to see us out, because their dream is to control us, having failed to do so a number of times before. France doesn't want us out, because some other patsy would then have to be found to subsidise their farmers.No-one would remember the Good Samaritan if he'd only had good intentions. He had money as well.
The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money.
Margaret Thatcher0 -
George Howell endorses Cameron threatening to stay in EU.GeorgeHowell wrote: »It could be, because if Cameron vetoed their federalisation treaty until and unless he got the concessions and opt outs (difficult to imagine in the face of rabid opposition from just about everybody, except for his own party and the majority of the electorate) they would probably be glad to see us out rather than see the federal/German hegemony dream stall.You might as well ask the Wizard of Oz to give you a big number as pay a Credit Referencing Agency for a so-called 'credit-score'0 -
George Howell endorses Cameron threatening to stay in EU.
George Howell endorses Cameron threatening to stay in the EU in order to be able to wield a veto with a view to achieving the best outcome for Britain.
There .. I finished it for you.No-one would remember the Good Samaritan if he'd only had good intentions. He had money as well.
The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money.
Margaret Thatcher0
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