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Term Time Holidays???
Comments
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Thank God for some common sense. It drives me mad how people use the results of statistics that looked at thousands if not million of data and think that they can apply to every single individual cases.
I am fortunate that both my children are G&T and way ahead of their year's curriculum. Their schools are struggling to challenge them at their level. Missing 5 days of school is highly unlikely to have any detrimental effect on them.
But we are not talking about a handful of cases here. One of the articles above said that holidays can account for 30-40% of absences. So if illness is the main absence and holidays are the second most common absence then any other form of truancy comes a poor third. I am not the one trying to twist the statistics here.
Also, a parent who is willing to take their kids out of school once for a nice little jolly is likely to be able to justify its multiple times over their child's school years.0 -
But we are not talking about a handful of cases here. One of the articles above said that holidays can account for 30-40% of absences. So if illness is the main absence and holidays are the second most common absence then any other form of truancy comes a poor third. I am not the one trying to twist the statistics here.
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I agree, you arent twisting them. You just havent the faintest idea how to use statistics and you are unaware of this limitation in your knowledge.
As an analogy, I will show you what you are doing, but use an example that is measurable and can be demonstrated to be wrong.
Accidents at work cause death
Most accidents are slips and trips
Therefore slips and trips cause the most death at work.
The above is literally the logic pattern that you are using. It is completely flawed.0 -
Where have I said that term time holidays are the most likely cause of poor school attainment? All I have said is that there is a link between the two. I have in no way tried to quantify the link.I agree, you arent twisting them. You just havent the faintest idea how to use statistics and you are unaware of this limitation in your knowledge.
As an analogy, I will show you what you are doing, but use an example that is measurable and can be demonstrated to be wrong.
Accidents at work cause death
Most accidents are slips and trips
Therefore slips and trips cause the most death at work.
The above is literally the logic pattern that you are using. It is completely flawed.
You have categorically said there is no link whatsoever without providing any evidence at all.0 -
Is that the level that you operate at, the "taking your bat and ball home" approach when things dont go your way.
I havent once said that teachers are abhorrent. It is yet another use of exaggeration and swinging to an extreme to avoid a rational and logical discussion about the real things that have been said.
2/10 - must try harder
Of course you have not said it. You have more than implied it, though.
I have refrained from entering a 'rational and logical discussion' about this issue because, according to you, pupils missing school has nothing to do with teachers and we shouldn't offer our opinions on it! However, I had to comment in your unpleasant attitude and your hurtful remarks. It's actually really not very nice to be reading something on a forum that you find interesting and suddenly come across a post such as your first one on this thread that makes sweeping generalisations about your profession and is really very unkind. Your later comments were no better.0 -
But we are not talking about a handful of cases here. One of the articles above said that holidays can account for 30-40% of absences. So if illness is the main absence and holidays are the second most common absence then any other form of truancy comes a poor third. I am not the one trying to twist the statistics here.
Also, a parent who is willing to take their kids out of school once for a nice little jolly is likely to be able to justify its multiple times over their child's school years.
But again, when it comes to a parent deciding whether to take a child on holiday, it is about the individual child, not the statistics. Schools care about statistics, and rightly so, I, as a parent care about my child. I know for a fact that my kids' education wouldn't be affected by them being off school for a week or so, or certainly no less so than what they are missing every day at school because the school doesn't have the resources to challenge their to their maximum capability.
As for the last comment, again a generalisation. I took my kids out of school once for three days. That was 4 years ago. I have not done it since. I might or I might not do it again.0 -
Where have I said that term time holidays are the most likely cause of poor school attainment? All I have said is that there is a link between the two. ..
despite a rather length report stating that there is no causal link.You have categorically said there is no link whatsoever without providing any evidence at all.
The onus is on the person proving that there is a link. Until that happens there isnt one. It is impossible to prove the non-existance of something.
Prove to me that you didnt murder someone last week, if you cant prove it then by your (lack of) logic you are a murderer.0 -
Of course you have not said it. You have more than implied it, though..
so essentially, you have translated it for me. Good, as long as we are agreed on that this only exists inside your head and that I havent said anything of the sort. If you want to distort my comments to come to that conclusion, feel free to.I have refrained from entering a 'rational and logical discussion' about this issue because, according to you, pupils missing school has nothing to do with teachers and we shouldn't offer our opinions on it! However, I had to comment in your unpleasant attitude and your hurtful remarks. It's actually really not very nice to be reading something on a forum that you find interesting and suddenly come across a post such as your first one on this thread that makes sweeping generalisations about your profession and is really very unkind. Your later comments were no better.
my generalisations and distortions were quite deliberate. They were a retort to those using the very same generalisations, such as "sunning themselves on a beach" and "p1$$ed up around the pool"
It works both ways, you know. I guess I have made my point with them now, it doesnt take a lot of talent to make cheap shots like that.0 -
Actually the onus is on the person making the original claim. All I was doing was showing a link between absence and attainment as a counter to your claim that there was no such link.despite a rather length report stating that there is no causal link.
The onus is on the person proving that there is a link. Until that happens there isnt one. It is impossible to prove the non-existance of something.
Prove to me that you didnt murder someone last week, if you cant prove it then by your (lack of) logic you are a murderer.
All I have said is: there is a correlation between absence and attainment, and holidays are a large proportion of absences. Any inferences from these are of your own making.0 -
so essentially, you have translated it for me. Good, as long as we are agreed on that this only exists inside your head and that I havent said anything of the sort. If you want to distort my comments to come to that conclusion, feel
As long as you are aware that that is how your comments come across and how people can interpret them.0 -
As long as you are aware that that is how your comments come across and how people can interpret them.
As I have said, my comments were quite deliberate to highlight a point.
It seemed ok to distort information (absense versus attainment) to imply a link between term time holidays and attainment then use a generalisation of p1$$ed up around the pool on a cheap holiday to imply that these parents dont care about their kids to further imply that they are poor parents.
Its all ok when it was working the other way. Now that these people have had a dose of their own medicine, they dont like it :cool:0
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