Retired people could work for pensions..

xylophone

Ask those who have private pensions and are means tested through taxation of their pension

.
The state pension is taxed as income just like the private pension.
Incidentally, I take it that you are receiving tax relief on your private pension?
So those pensioners who are now paying tax are indirectly benefiting you...

PaulF81

ILW wrote: »

He does appear rather bitter.
I think it's because he cannot afford to buy a house.

thanks very much, but actually sat on quite a nice nest egg actually, in bricks and mortar.

ash28

PaulF81 wrote: »

those last 2 paragraphs are my entire point, if you havent paid in you should get nowt.

the talk of means testing the state pension is perverse; for those never having paid in, they shouldnt be on any more than the jobseekers allowance, no winter fuel allowance and other benefits. absolute breadline. if anything, the state pension should have an opt out, vis a vis the nhs, with significant savings for higher and top rate tax payers who pay the bulk of the bill and can expect the same treatment.

as for your comments on dignitas, for those who havent contributed a jot, absolutely, yes. same with crimes that once were considered capital and crimes against children. not only do you lose your right to freedom during your tenure, you also have a death sentence if you become seriously ill past retirement age. palliative care by all means, but no wonder drugs gene therapy, organ transplants etc. those who havent contributed into the system, again, we have to recognise the nhs is bleeding the country dry and savings have to be made. those pensioners that a well enough to help but didnt contribute enough for full ni credits during their lives could pay for a nhs insurance through helping the system, either assisting those who are ill or have no facultys, or going into local services if they have the requisite skills.

otherwise those at the end of their lives will be screwing it for the younger generations.

the nif is smaller than it should be for one reason. those in reciept of the state pension never paid enough to cover their pensions in combination with the other services they recieved in their lifetimes. and now they want someone else to foot their bill.

They paid enough in to cover someone else's pension, which is how the scheme works.

In a perfect world those payments would have been invested over the period of someone's working life and paid out to them in retirement. Never happened and never will happen.

The NIF fund is smaller than it should be because the surplus is used to buy government gilts over terms of up to 20 years. A case of the government borrowing from itself?

xylophone

The NIF fund is smaller than it should be because the surplus is used to buy government gilts over terms of up to 20 years. A case of the government borrowing from itself?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Insurance_Fund
"Each year there is a surplus of the order of £2 billion. The NIF had a surplus of over £34 billion as at 2005/06, £38 billion in 2006/7 and the Government Actuary's Department forecasts that this surplus will grow to over £114.7 billion by 2012.[3]
This surplus figure has been revised in recent years due to errors in assumptions by the GAD and now is forecast to be just £30 billion by 2016. http://www.gad.gov.uk/Documents/Social%20Security/GAD_Report_2012.pdf
The surplus is loaned to the government through the Debt Management Office which is part of the Commissioners for the Reduction of the National Debt in Call Notice Deposits (previously invested in gilt-edged securities) and interest on these invested monies is paid to the NIF - £1.3 billion in the 2007/08 year.
The balance in the National Insurance Fund at the end of each calendar month can be seen at the following government website:
http://www.dmo.gov.uk/index.aspx?page=CRND/Fund_Portfolio
Levels of benefit and contributions are set following the advice of the Government Actuary, who recommends that a prudential balance of two months contribution revenue (about £8 billion) should be kept in the fund."

PaulF81

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

Well...there we have it - Admission Central - as in this poster does indeed seem to think that we should all "shuffle off our mortal coil" (whether we like it or no) once we have ceased to be earning:eek:

The pity of it is - I think he is totally serious in his view on this and honestly DOES believe we should all be euthanised - whether we like it or no:eek:

not at all. i just dont think vast sums of moneynshould be spent on expensive health care which would otherwise go on infrasructure, education or even giving us all a fair pension... just so said prsons can sit at home griping about the latest front page of the express or the mail for another 5 or 10 years.

PaulF81

ash28 wrote: »

They paid enough in to cover someone else's pension, which is how the scheme works.

In a perfect world those payments would have been invested over the period of someone's working life and paid out to them in retirement. Never happened and never will happen.

The NIF fund is smaller than it should be because the surplus is used to buy government gilts over terms of up to 20 years. A case of the government borrowing from itself?

expensive health care or the state pension. one or the other. not both. your choice.

thorsoak

PaulF81 wrote: »

not at all. i just dont think vast sums of moneynshould be spent on expensive health care which would otherwise go on infrasructure, education or even giving us all a fair pension... just so said prsons can sit at home griping about the latest front page of the express or the mail for another 5 or 10 years.

Fast-forward 15/20 years ......what will PaulF81 be doing???

PaulF81

saying the same thing. with a generation in power repaying the favour.

thorsoak

PaulF81 wrote: »

saying the same thing.

...will you be expecting your one-way ticket to Dignitas as well?

Or will you be out there, shovelling snow for those who are at work??

PaulF81

thorsoak wrote: »

...will you be expecting your one-way ticket to Dignitas as well?

Or will you be out there, shovelling snow for those who are at work??

a bit of both. ready to accept my fate whilst happy in the knowledge i am not eating my own childrens future.

it wou
d have may benefits. not least reverse the moral hazard the nhs generates with respect to lifestyle choice. as i said, the natural order of things.