Been called for medical - not happy

Tottyshouse

PippaGirl wrote: »

That's NOT what my therapist said. What he said is that extensive studies have shown that over 70% of the population have at one time had thoughts of ending their life and that most of those have never experienced depression. That is a very different statement to the one you have just made saying suicide isn't a sign of being depressed.

What it is saying is that someone with suicidal thoughts may not be depressed.

Then I have issues with your therapist. It is normal to think of death. It is normal to wonder what death is like. It is not the sign of a normal happy healthy mind to think about actively killing yourself which is surely what suicidal thoughts are? I can say when I had suicidal thoughts I was depressed. I can say when I took steps twice to end my life I was depressed. If I had suicidal thoughts now I would be very worried. If someone I knew or loved said they had suicidal thoughts I would be very worried and I would actively take steps to intervene whether they would label themselves as "depressed" or not. I am sure if you went to your GP and said I have suicidal thoughts they would pop "depression" on your notes.

Muttleythefrog

Tottyshouse wrote: »

Then I have issues with your therapist. It is normal to think of death. It is normal to wonder what death is like. It is not the sign of a normal happy healthy mind to think about actively killing yourself which is surely what suicidal thoughts are? I can say when I had suicidal thoughts I was depressed. I can say when I took steps twice to end my life I was depressed. If I had suicidal thoughts now I would be very worried. If someone I knew or loved said they had suicidal thoughts I would be very worried and I would actively take steps to intervene whether they would label themselves as "depressed" or not. I am sure if you went to your GP and said I have suicidal thoughts they would pop "depression" on your notes.

Don't underestimate the capacity of people to reason that suicide is a good option. In fact there's a series going on at moment by Richard Dawkins... the last episode asking 'why should the atheist bother getting up in the morning'. It's arguable that only fools choose to live with the futility of it all. To me.. suicide is something I'd do if I felt uplifted.. more in control.. it definitely isn't the option I'd enact in my worse times because I'd be incapable of it... suicide for me required deep planning and lots of order surrounding the events of... complexity added due to predictions being prevailent in the planning. One of the reasons my 'main' psychiatrist was resistant to prescribe my AD drugs was the fear that if the mood was lifted then self destructive behaviours would become more likely... to be honest I think she was only prescribing anything because I was hounding for medication... and I was only hounding for medication to remain in contact with MH services... and I was only remaining in contact with MH services to aid my benefit claims. What a farce.

krisskross

mazza111 wrote: »

There are some pensioners who are extremely well off though krisskross. Just like you see some disabled people as well off. I can see some pensioners who are extremely well off.

But if pensioners didn't get their free bus passes, would there be as many buses on the road as they are subsidised? Wouldn't it be a better idea for them to pay a half fare like we do with children aged 5-16?


I have to agree with pippagirl about the bedroom tax. Surely this was introduced to get people to downsize, like I did when the dd left home. Are you sure pensioners aren't included in this pippagirl?
If they aren't, then it's kinda defeating the purpose surely?


I have to take back what I said about the winter fuel allowance, I thought all pensioners got it, but it's only some on certain benefits that do get it.

It's only the over 75s who get their tv license free. Not all pensioners, which I think is fairy nuff, but do wonder if those wealthy pensioners should be getting it.

Tottyshouse, I don't think it's about pulling someone from their comfort zone, but encouraging them to get the help they need. You can't force someone to get medical treatment. I had an aunt who's breast was almost eaten away by cancer before any medical treatment was sought, why? Because she had a phobia of doctors, another MH condition. Now without a doubt, with counselling, she could have beaten this condition and got checked before it got to the stage where she died from the cancer. But how on earth can you force someone to get medical attention against their will?

I'm pretty sure my dd is only getting the help she's getting now because I'm forcing the issue for her. Many don't have family to do that for them, and are usually isolated from family because of their MH issues. Whether that be from them shutting themselves away from everyone, or the family washing their hands of them.

Depression and anxiety disorders can affect everyone differently, and just because one can, doesn't mean all can.

We do get the winter fuel allowance but not cold weather payments...they are totally different.

I am amazed that people cast covetous eyes at the 'perks' we get as pensioners. Very few actually as many of the benefits available to pensioners are means tested which effectively rules out anyone with even a fairly small private pension in addition to the state one which they have no doubt paid in for over many decades. Until fairly recently a man needed 40+ years of NI contributions and a woman 39 years to qualify for a full state pension.

I could say is it fair that you on sickness benefits can afford to run a car but we as pensioners can't? I expect you also get help with your housing costs, we don't.

I doubt very much that all pensioners claim the free TV licence, WFA or bus pass. They are not given automatically. After all I believe people of pensionable age are the least likely to claim benefits that they are entitled to.

BTW the WFA is simply a token instead of raising the SRP. Far better to give pensioners £2 a week rise which would be taxable so some would be clawed back and would stop envious people bleating on interminably about how unfair this allowance is. Do people really begrudge £2 a week each to a pensioner couple?

~Chameleon~

Tottyshouse wrote: »

Then I have issues with your therapist. It is normal to think of death. It is normal to wonder what death is like. It is not the sign of a normal happy healthy mind to think about actively killing yourself which is surely what suicidal thoughts are? I can say when I had suicidal thoughts I was depressed. I can say when I took steps twice to end my life I was depressed. If I had suicidal thoughts now I would be very worried. If someone I knew or loved said they had suicidal thoughts I would be very worried and I would actively take steps to intervene whether they would label themselves as "depressed" or not. I am sure if you went to your GP and said I have suicidal thoughts they would pop "depression" on your notes.

I can assure you, you can have suicidal thoughts and be actively suicidal without being depressed.

In fact the inertia caused by depression is often the very thing that prevents somebody actively completing a suicide!

MUMZ2BEE

What a relief!!

Just spoken to a lovely lady from MIND.

They can have someone attend my benefit medical with me other then my relative!!

I feel so much more happier I now have someone there fore me during a stressful time in my life!!

Still waiting to hear back from adult mental health though with an outpatient appointment!!

It just feel like a weight has been lifted on my shoulders and I can now relax more, knowing that they can come with me and help with an appeal if need be!!

Phew!!

Tottyshouse

PippaGirl wrote: »

I think that statement should be gold plated. Actually shame that everytime someone started a thread in this forum there wasn't an automatic 2nd post attached to it as it went live saying "this board is for benefit advice only, please refrain from moral judgements and personal criticism".

Though if it happened and people adhered to it, there would probably be only a few regulars here as the majority are not here to help others and provide advice but get some sort of kick out of hounding others they look down on.

I am sure there are some sad individuals who trawl this site looking to make controversial remarks - but a lot of what I read are just people with differing points of view. Benefits and especially those surrounding being too ill to work are always going to be emotive - because in many cases whether someone can or can't work is highly subjective. There are clear cut cases where people absolutely cannot work - or in the case of terminal illnesses shouldn't be forced to spend the precious time they have left at work. Then there are the more "hazy" cases where person A says they can't work, yet person B has the same illness, the same symptoms but hasn't missed a day at work in 20 years. I want those who are genuinely incapable of work to be looked after. But I think it is only right that claimants have to take a good hard look at themselves and answer genuinely am I really incapable of any work? am I doing all that I can to get to stage where a return to work is feasible? What I am afraid of is in ten or 20 years time we end up with a system that cannot support the genuine - because we have been toofrightened to tackle the liars, the lazy and the complacent.

krisskross

Tottyshouse wrote: »

What I am afraid of is in ten or 20 years time we end up with a system that cannot support the genuine - because we have been toofrightened to tackle the liars, the lazy and the complacent.

:T:T:T:T Wish i could thank this more than once.

Muttleythefrog

Tottyshouse wrote: »

What I am afraid of is in ten or 20 years time we end up with a system that cannot support the genuine - because we have been toofrightened to tackle the liars, the lazy and the complacent.

That's what we've got now. The problem is the latter groups are in positions of political or economic power.

mazza111

krisskross wrote: »

We do get the winter fuel allowance but not cold weather payments...they are totally different.

I am amazed that people cast covetous eyes at the 'perks' we get as pensioners. Very few actually as many of the benefits available to pensioners are means tested which effectively rules out anyone with even a fairly small private pension in addition to the state one which they have no doubt paid in for over many decades. Until fairly recently a man needed 40+ years of NI contributions and a woman 39 years to qualify for a full state pension.

I could say is it fair that you on sickness benefits can afford to run a car but we as pensioners can't? I expect you also get help with your housing costs, we don't.

I doubt very much that all pensioners claim the free TV licence, WFA or bus pass. They are not given automatically. After all I believe people of pensionable age are the least likely to claim benefits that they are entitled to.

BTW the WFA is simply a token instead of raising the SRP. Far better to give pensioners £2 a week rise which would be taxable so some would be clawed back and would stop envious people bleating on interminably about how unfair this allowance is. Do people really begrudge £2 a week each to a pensioner couple?

I don't grudge pensioners getting their £2 a week. I grudge those not in need getting it. There is a difference. Yes, I can afford to run my car, not because I'm getting ESA, but because I use my retirement money to do so. And definitely not covetous. I just don't see why, when the country is in such a mess, as they keep telling us, that the worse of in society are getting less, when the rich are getting benefits, whether that be the WFA or the CWP, free tv license or free bus travel.

You know I couldn't tell you the last time I used my car for my own use? If it wasn't for the dd and the dm then I would probably get rid of it. Because you are saying that, does that make you covetous? Of course not, so please do not imply that I am covetous of any pensioner getting what they get.

You seem to be very objective of people getting sickness benefits or disability benefits, but as soon as someone mentions pensioner benefits, we are covetous?? Seriously, think what you write on here most of the time.


Do those pensioners with hundreds of thousands sitting in the bank really need these benefits? I'm not talking borderline cases here, I think if you care to read back, I said WEALTHY pensioners.


No one likes those who don't work who can and the ones playing the system. Unfortunately, it's those who are sick or disabled who are paying the price for a system that's not working for them.

There was a story in today's Daily Record about another ATOS sham where the gentleman died just after being found fit for work. Now one or two mistakes can happen, but unfortunately they are happening all to often where ATOS is concerned. By all means have a WCA, but these must be done honestly.

MUMZ2BEE

There was a story in today's Daily Record about another ATOS sham where the gentleman died just after being found fit for work. Now one or two mistakes can happen, but unfortunately they are happening all to often where ATOS is concerned. By all means have a WCA, but these must be done honestly.[/QUOTE]

I totally agree for these medicals to be made fairer and less stressful for the claimant.

I also agree ATOS are a disgrace deliberately giving false information to the DWP to kick someone off benefit they are entitled to.

I have a heart condition, and long term mental health issues, I am very grateful MIND can now help me with my problems!!

I am expecting to score 0 points anyway; then go through the awful process of appeals and tribunals!!

It makes you wonder is it really worth putting yourself all through unnecessary stress!!??