Is it dodgy?

Worried

It's a long one, but please read and advise if you have the time!

Found a house we like, on at 215995. It's on with a particular estate agent, who now share premises with our independant financial advisor. We went in today to get an agreement in principle, which all went fine and had second viewing booked on house tonight. When we met with IFA he advised us that there had already been an offer on the house, sometime last week. The estate agent hadn't advise us of this on our first viewing or when i rang to book second. They were aware that the IFA informed us of this today. He unofficially told us that the offer was for 214k, but that the property hadn't been taken off the market as there had been some delay and the valuation hadn't been booked in. He more or less told us that if we want the house, we would be looked on favourably with the estate agent as we are clients of his and he can vouch for us being able to move quickly and get the application done and valuation booked in. He more or less suggested, if we match the offer, we could have it.

On second viewing we decided we do really like the house and think it's worth that sort of money to us, but what do you think about hearing about the offer second hand? Why did the agent not inform us directly? We are FTBs and have no idea if these other buyers are. It may be that the vendors may take a lower offer if we have that advantage over the people who have offered, so don't want to go in at 214k without knowing this. I think we are interested on offering on the property, but do you think we should ask the agent directly what is happening with the other offer and then go from there? Really like the house, but the way this is being handled concerns me. An agent couldn't make up a fictional offer could they, to try and get us to place a high offer? What do you think about the situation?

McAzrael

Agents can make up what they like - who is to know. Never, ever, forget that the agent does not work for you, until you come to sell ahouse when you should never, ever, forget that the agent is supposed to be working for you.

Having looked at this house and similar ones on the area, what is this house worth to you? Offer that amount. The vendor has two choices.

mchu6am4

All the hallmarks of a 'fishy' inside dealing - Unfortunately, if the IFA & EA are good mates (& probably are) then they both know how much money you have including deposit, bank balances, your wage etc. etc. hence they know exactly how much you can afford and will try to get the max out of you.

It's not a good combination I got to say but unfortunately you've already visited this IFA and you have no comeback as you've given all your information already.

I don't know what to say - you want to check the sold house prices and make sure you're not paying over the odds (and remember as a FTB you're in a really strong position especially if the buyer is also in a chain.)

Ash

Worried

It never even occured to me that this situation could arise. Can people really be so underhand? Sould we just ignore what we've heard then and go in with a much lower offer, as we prob would have if we hadn't been told this? The agent has to put it forward don't they, or do you think they would just sit on it maintain there had been an offer of 214k? We didn't raise the subject of the offer with the vendor when we went round for a second viewing. Wish we had now. Any more advice please? Could it not be genuine?

mchu6am4

Worried wrote: »

It never even occured to me that this situation could arise. Can people really be so underhand? Sould we just ignore what we've heard then and go in with a much lower offer, as we prob would have if we hadn't been told this? The agent has to put it forward don't they, or do you think they would just sit on it maintain there had been an offer of 214k? We didn't raise the offer with the vendor when we went round for a second viewing. Wish we had now. Any more advice please? Could it not be genuine?

There was a big undercover documentary on BBC a while ago regarding the same situation you find yourself in. That's because they are sharing your info with one another, and are one step ahead of what you are thinking.

I would do some research on sold prices and go in with a lower offer and see what happens - but remember (as most FTBs do) don't keep calling the EA, you're playing in their hands - cool down and let your brain rule rather than the heart - let EA do the chasing (that way I got £7k knocked off and also found out about all the porkies he had been telling me all along for me to keep raising my offers).

Ash

Doozergirl

...or if there is another offer then hanging on and playing waiting games won't get you the house.

You can only go with your gut. I can spot it a mile off these days. If you do suspect something then go back for another viewing and ask the vendor outright id they have another offer. Vendors are far less likely to BS you (at this stage anyway :rolleyes:)

I put in an offer on a repossession this morning. The EA said "I'll get back to you within the hour" which I was surprised by as it has always taken at least a day in the past, due to protocol I suspect. Five minutes later, the phone rings and, low and behold mortgage company has rejected my offer. Within those two phone calls the EA managed to drop what he thought they would accept by £13k which ended up £3k above my offer, because I wasn't biting. He also contradicted what he told me on Saturday when I met him. I am entirely frustrated by some agents' inability to be honest and their blatantly fake attempts to build a rapport with me. :wall:

Tomorrow when I suspect he will call me as I didn't call him back as promised, I shall ask why my formal notification of offer hasn't arrived in the post and then he will know that I am not as gullible as he would like.

mchu6am4

Doozergirl wrote: »

...or if there is another offer then hanging on and playing waiting games won't get you the house.

You can only go with your gut. I can spot it a mile off these days. If you do suspect something then go back for another viewing and ask the vendor outright id they have another offer. Vendors are far less likely to BS you (at this stage anyway :rolleyes:)

I put in an offer on a repossession this morning. The EA said "I'll get back to you within the hour" which I was surprised by as it has always taken at least a day in the past, due to protocol I suspect. Five minutes later, the phone rings and, low and behold mortgage company has rejected my offer. Within those two phone calls the EA managed to drop what he thought they would accept by £13k which ended up £3k above my offer, because I wasn't biting. He also contradicted what he told me on Saturday when I met him. I am entirely frustrated by some agents' inability to be honest and their blatantly fake attempts to build a rapport with me. :wall:

Tomorrow when I suspect he will call me as I didn't call him back as promised, I shall ask why my formal notification of offer hasn't arrived in the post and then he will know that I am not as gullible as he would like.

Nice One !!! I wish you were negotiating on my behalf (as I got turned down on a repossession offer - and was told survey etc. had taken place though the house is still on the market, 4 weeks later!)

I moved on and am in the process of purchasing another property, though the lies are common (even from this new EA)!!!

Worried

What do you think to us trying to see the house again tomorrow evening and taking a friend, or parent, so it looks like we're getting someone elses opinion on it. Have a good look round and then approach the subject of the offer with the vendor. If the IFA and the agent are playing a game with us, do you think the vendor would be informed of what they are doing? Isn't it a bit risk on the agents part if they're not in on it and we ask them directly? When I phone to arrange the viewing, I could enquire about the offer with the agent and hear it from the horses mouth. Is this the way to play it? Is there anyone who thinks this could be a legitimate situation, or does it seem fishy to everyone?

mchu6am4

I wouldn't suggest to anyone (even vendor) that you suspect some collusion. This could potentially damage your relationship with all parties concerned.

You may want to ask the seller about the offer directly but you need to do your research and find out what's its worth etc. and what you want to pay max etc. and then make an informed offer (and remember offers always go up so start as low as possible without taking the p*ss).

Good luck and let us know how you go on. Hopefully other forum members can advise you better on how to approach this.

Worried

Oh no, I don't mean putting it to the vendor that we think there's something dodgy going on, but maybe go back and have a good look round and maybe play it like we're sorry to take up their time again, but we've bought a friend for a second opinion because we've got two houses that we're keen on (not true) and say is it right that you've accepted an offer on this property already? That's a legitimate question that you'd ask even if you didn't suspect anything isn't it?

Doozergirl

It could be legitimate!

I don't really understand why an IFA is getting involved. If the valuation hasn't been booked then it would suggest that either the potential buyer hasn't been given enough chance to organise things or that they have decided they don't want the place.

You really do need to make up your own mind as to what it is worth and not deviate and be prepared to walk away. If you think it's worth it then fine, but don't allow what has been said to cloud your judgement. Ignore it. In fact, see it as a tip that £214k is the most you should be paying, not your opening offer. Play your own game, offer what you want to. £214k is a laughable first offer and the vendors have brain cell they'll be coming back to ask for the full asking.

Don't mention what you've been told to anyone, just ask the vendor 'have you had any other offers?' That isn't leading or suggesting and only warrants a straight answer.