Lane discipline.

mkirkby

Crabman wrote: »

You're wondering why drivers obey the speed limit through a section of roadworks enforced by average speed cameras? :rotfl:

As the previous poster said, I'm not wondering why people stick to the limit, but why when the inside two lanes are sometimes *totally* clear, they still refuse to move over.

Oddly enough, I've seen many a case like this when the 50 changes back to a 70 & the outside hogger decides it's now OK to move over!

Weird; just very weird.

Herzlos

Because a lot of roadworks have (or had) signs instructing people to stay in lanes?

On the middle lane issue, and pulling in if there's a gap big enough to be overtaken in; if it's busy, and you're clearly going faster than the traffic on the left (say ~70 vs ~56) but there's a gap, should you pull in in hope that the car about 4 behind you will let you back out when you've caught up?

In reality in a lot of cases, changing left a lane when it's even moderately busy just serves to have you jump back a few places in the queue (if you're lucky) even if you weren't actually going slower than the cars behind you.

This is probably a combination of the road-train effect (matching the car in front - if a gap appears then accelerate to catch up to it, and then following on behind) and middle lane hoggers (who have plenty of opportunity to move left a lane), so becomes a bit self fulfilling.

If there's a big enough gap in the lane over for me to sit for a while I'll pull in, or if there's space ahead for someone to overtake. But only if I judge there to be sufficient space to do so safely.

mkirkby

Herzlos wrote: »

Because a lot of roadworks have (or had) signs instructing people to stay in lanes?

Nope; not in the cases I'm talking about here. No instructions to stay in lanes except the brain of the person driving

iolanthe07

At the risk of inuring the wrath of many people, I ride a bike which doesn't even register on the average speed cameras so I tend to move along at about 60 as I'm much less dangerous at that speed than even a car doing 50.

I realise that bikers think the traffic law don't apply to them, but the limit is still supposed to be 50 for everyone. Also, as the above poster wrote, many of these roadworks have signs instructing drivers to stay in their lane.

fivetide

mkirkby wrote: »

Nope; not in the cases I'm talking about here. No instructions to stay in lanes except the brain of the person driving

I think it is because people incorrectly refer to it as 'the slow lane' and they simply don't want to be in that lane for that reason.

They convince themselves it is just for lorries etc and refuse to drive in it.

5t.

[Deleted User]

mkirkby wrote: »

the brain of the person driving

But at we all know 50% of people driving do not have a brain and of the remaining 50% driving ability-concentration-using phone-thinking about facebook/twitter all reduce the concentration of a life risking task:eek:

Sorry for the rant but have spent the last week back and forth to the hospital and have been disgusted at the drivers in around the car parks and surrounding roads:mad:

thebull

The standard of driving in this country is appalling people don't indicate they hog the middle or outside lane they park on footpath's they park facing oncoming traffic they park right on junctions they drive to slow they tail gate .
In short since the government loves to bleed the motorist dry I would mount loads more cameras everywhere to catch lane hoggers and the like £100 fine no points though and lets get those Public Information films back on TV telling us how to Drive and not drop litter and .....................oh why bother Great Britain not any more were all on the way to hell in a handcart .That will be in the wrong lane too

Wongsky

zenmaster wrote: »

What?

1. Pull back into the inside lane and I guarantee that next time you are approaching a slow moving vehicle noone will let you pull out to pass.
2. Motorway signage is so bad that you can never discern whether the inside lane runs into an exit lane, an interchange, or merely an indication that there are options ahead.

Middle lane all the way for me.

That's not to say I support lane indiscipline.

I am a strong advocate for the death penalty for those who abuse filter lanes by steaming down one such lane, indicating, then switching (crimes against humanity).

As for those who let them in? Minimum 2 years inside and compulsory crushing of their vehicle for aiding and abetting.

Both points are such a crock - and normally a tell that somebody has poor observation and a bit afraid of changing lanes.

I've never seen a scenario where in normal free flowing traffic, lane changes were impossible - perhaps not right at the exact moment you want to change lanes, but I've never seen instances of cars really "trapped" in the inside lane, behind something like a truck.

The knack of driving on the motorway, is constant, vigilant and better observation than perhaps you'd give to more urban driving on slower roads. Building up a picture of the traffic both ahead and behind, and planning when you need to change lanes, ideally to maintain your preferred speed.

In my experience, most MLOC seem either oblivious to what's going on around them, or lazy and just prefer to stay in the middle lane(s) where the likelihood is they'll largely be OK, and not need to observe so much or have to change lanes - you can almost see it, sometimes, in that they're reluctant to change lanes, but after a while, if there's something truly slow in the middle lane(s) they'll eventually go "Pah!" and have to change lanes.

The problem is, with them, is:-

1. They tend to be oblivious to what's around them
2. They reduce the capacity of the motorway often effectively reducing the number of lanes for faster traffic
3. Themselves can be obstructive when traffic overtakes them, returns to the inside lane, and they then speed up and make it awkward for drivers actually observing good lane discipline to move out - either because they're irked that somebody has highlighted their fully paid-up MLOC membership, or their speed is largely governed by what's in the middle lane(s) in front of them, and varies quite a bit.

Now and again, the matrix signs do sometimes have messages encouraging them to move over - but I suspect it largely falls on deaf ears.

What's needed is a more focused campaign - like the speed and drink / driving thing - to make it recognised as the pest it is, to largely change public opinion from being ambivalent, and to hand out many 3 points and £60 fines for driving without due care and attention - then maybe some of the rhetoric about road prices and congestion could be addressed by something other than punitive taxation on the motorist who's already taxed heavily.

Wongsky

Dave101t wrote: »

i just continue on my journey in lane one, if i seem to undertake them, im not, as im not performing a maneuver, simply making my progress. done it past police and they dont stop me, or the lane hog, unfortunately.

I like to think of it as filtering - as can be completely fine and valid on one-way roads (which is effectively what motorways are on each carriageway).

My understanding, is that overtaking is a deliberate move where you effectively move over to pass something. If you're maintaining speed, and haven't actually moved to a left hand lane purely to overtake some muppet who won't budge from the middle lane(s) regardless of need, I don't get the drama.

Any lane change - either left, or right, should be done with full visibility, and surely accidents will largely be the fault of the driver making the lane change / manoeuvre, if proper observation hasn't been made.

Wongsky

Crabman wrote: »

Not at all. My policy is "keep left unless overtaking." It's simple and it works.

Unfortunately others come on with their own little philosophies & rules and inexplicably expect others on the road to adhere.

Expecting people to not hog overtaking lanes, though, doesn't fall into that category.

Crabman wrote: »

I'd like to see everyone keep left unless overtaking, yet the reality is that the BMW/Audi/Merc drivers will happily moan away about middle lane hogs whilst they carry on hogging the outside lane and keep one car length from the vehicle in front.

Agreed with some of that - there are some outer laners that effectively hog those lanes, too.

Keep left unless overtaking is quite simple - doesn't require darting in and out of lanes continually, but also should mean a bit of common sense, in that if there's nothing imminent (I don't mean miles / minutes away) you're going to pass, and there's an empty lane on the inside, you should largely be driving in it (unless it's signed for something else (filter, busses...).