Relative refusing professional care...?

bestpud

margaretclare wrote: »

'The money will go into a trust'? So who benefits from the trust? Not the person who needs it urgently now???

He has free access to the money now but he has tied it up after his death. He honestly has no need to hang onto the cash - no need at all - it's mad!

It's mainly that there is a life interest in a property for one of the children.

It's complicated and I don't want to go into it here but there will be no cash released for many years.

margaretclare

bestpud wrote: »

He hasn't spent his pension in months - he has no shortage of money - all of it could be used for care and he may hardly touch his savings.

I honestly don't think he's given a thought for the effect on the family - he sees it as their responsibility to care for him.

I'm not saying he doesn't give a stuff - it's just he's set in his ways and it's how he sees things should be iykwim?

Yes, I know what you mean, I've heard this before, but I'd better not say what I really think. 'Selfish and inconsiderate' doesn't even come close to what I'd really like to say. Martin would ban me, for sure!

'He hasn't spent his pension in months' but he must have to buy food, pay all the normal household bills etc? That's what most people's pension gets spent on, and even if there's some left over to save, the bulk of it still has to get spent on normal living.

bestpud

Mojisola wrote: »

So he's not taking it with him but is going to try to control it from beyond the grave!

I think you may have to stand up to him and say either he pays for a certain amount of care or he copes on his own for a couple of days a week.

Without the emotions around the fact that he's dying, everyone would be able to see that he's bullying you all into doing things his way with no thought for your wellbeing.

That's one of the emotional difficulties - he has created a scenario that may cause many problems in the family after his death and has already hurt them.

That said, they are doing their best for him - it's difficult though, for a few reasons I don't want to go into.

As I said earlier, the emotional toll on the family is huge but they're aren't letting it affect the care he receives and are doing all the can to abide by his wishes.

londonsurrey

bestpud wrote: »

That's one of the emotional difficulties - he has created a scenario that may cause many problems in the family after his death and has already hurt them.

That said, they are doing their best for him - it's difficult though, for a few reasons I don't want to go into.

As I said earlier, the emotional toll on the family is huge but they're aren't letting it affect the care he receives and are doing all the can to abide by his wishes.

In that case, what I said about the carers making their own decisions stands.

By not standing by their own line in the sand, they are enabling him to carry on, they're getting upset, and then wondering why he doesn't buck up his ideas.

bestpud

margaretclare wrote: »

Yes, I know what you mean, I've heard this before, but I'd better not say what I really think. 'Selfish and inconsiderate' doesn't even come close to what I'd really like to say. Martin would ban me, for sure!

'He hasn't spent his pension in months' but he must have to buy food, pay all the normal household bills etc? That's what most people's pension gets spent on, and even if there's some left over to save, the bulk of it still has to get spent on normal living.

He has few bills and one of the children still lives with him so they buy the food. He has money coming out of his ears, honestly, and not only that in the bank.

He wears clothes for decades and doesn't every buy anything unecessarily.

There is no mortgage or rent and no water rates as it's on a well. He lives very frugally.

Mindless_Clone

Oh dear, your poor relatives. What a dilemma.

If there are free options for care and support out there or he has to pay for it isn't really relevant if he won't take anyone.
If he doens't want and can't be persuaded to take those options up then you might need to force his hand by withdrawing some of the care he's getting from those relatives looking after him. Sounds hard I know but a few hours on his own will probably be all he needs to realise he can't go on. As it stands, what's going to happen when one of his carers gets sick? Runs him/herself into the ground with illness because of this? It will happen and then he'll have no choice.
I think he's being quite selfish - perhaps not deliberately but his pride is having a detrimental affect on everyone around him and he needs to have his eyes opened to that. You might have to give him a bit of tough love to make him accept this help.

failing that, are there any legal options you might be able to explore - perhaps that he's not fit to decide these things himself? Not sure if you could do that but could be worth looking into.

I hope you can resolve this for everyone's sake.

bestpud

I guess they can only carry on or leave him to it and nobody will do that. Who could, in all honesty?

This is one of those very difficult situations you just don't think about until you see it happen.

Thanks for all the suggestions everyone.

tea_lover

Perhaps just leaving him to it (for a short amount of time only) will give him the wake up call he needs though.

Heartbreaking decisions to have to make.

Mindless_Clone

I know, it's a hard thing to do - tough love - but you might be able to talk to him about the affect caring for him is having on everyone, and put some of the scenarios in his head "what if soanso is taken ill and nobody can come..." and see if you can't actually get him thinking. Make the suggestion that you will have to cut back on the care the family give and see how he reacts. Obviously I don't know what he's like personality wise so can't say if that would be a good idea or not but maybe he simply doesn't understand how physically and emotionally demanding this is for those looking after him.

The other thing you could do is to look at the social care side and see if you can't get some care aids in the home for him. Little things like a commode, or an adjustable bed etc. Does he walk/stand at all? My mum is unable to walk but can stand with two carers, on a device calls a SamHall Turner. This is something you can hold onto (with help) and be turned to sit on a wheelchair or commode. My mum gets to the toilet by being manoeuvred onto the commode using this device, and the commode wheeled round to the toilet so it acts as a seat over the main toilet (i.e. no bucket underneath). It's just like using a normal toilet really. Not sure if something like this might help get him about a bit because I don't know how frail he is but just a thought.
If you don't have this, or any other similar care package in place, at least speak to the GP and see how you go about getting the social care team in to come and assess his needs and fit some disability aids to help the carers do things a bit easier.

bestpud

Mindless_Clone wrote: »

I know, it's a hard thing to do - tough love - but you might be able to talk to him about the affect caring for him is having on everyone, and put some of the scenarios in his head "what if soanso is taken ill and nobody can come..." and see if you can't actually get him thinking. Make the suggestion that you will have to cut back on the care the family give and see how he reacts. Obviously I don't know what he's like personality wise so can't say if that would be a good idea or not but maybe he simply doesn't understand how physically and emotionally demanding this is for those looking after him.

The other thing you could do is to look at the social care side and see if you can't get some care aids in the home for him. Little things like a commode, or an adjustable bed etc. Does he walk/stand at all? My mum is unable to walk but can stand with two carers, on a device calls a SamHall Turner. This is something you can hold onto (with help) and be turned to sit on a wheelchair or commode. My mum gets to the toilet by being manoeuvred onto the commode using this device, and the commode wheeled round to the toilet so it acts as a seat over the main toilet (i.e. no bucket underneath). It's just like using a normal toilet really. Not sure if something like this might help get him about a bit because I don't know how frail he is but just a thought.
If you don't have this, or any other similar care package in place, at least speak to the GP and see how you go about getting the social care team in to come and assess his needs and fit some disability aids to help the carers do things a bit easier.

A lot of care aids can't be used as the house (two up two down cottage with added on bits that weren't designed with disabled people in mind) isn't suitable - small rooms so not much space at all for anything in the bedroom and there is only just enough space to walk to the bathroom so no chance of getting a wheelchair there.

One of them has to stand in the bath to help him on and off the toilet and then on various fixed items to get him from one room to another.

There is also steps up and down on the ground floor.

It would be considerably easier in a more modern house!