Preparedness for when

[Deleted User]

I think you will be a great loss FUDDLE and missed by all your friends. It's such a sadness when dissent and anger raises it's head amongst us, partly my fault for which I once again appologise profusely, I should have had more restraint than to reply so hotly and vociferously to a post. I know how hurt you are by this type of event and I'm sad that you feel you can't post on either this or the doorstep threads any longer because of predjudice against you. You are not in any way to take blame for any of this, it's a clash of personalities and ideals and some thoughtlessness and ire. I'll miss your posts, Lyn xxx.

fuddle

Only an idiot would quit the most insightful thread on MSE... and I'm no idiot. This thread I am staying very much a part of.

[Deleted User]

Good on you girlie, I'm usually proud of you but doubly so for that, good kid!!!

CRANKY40

I've been reading this thread the past couple of days and I've learnt a lot thank you. Not in terms of hands on survival, but about banks and monetary issues. The Greek crisis is worrying and talk of the collapse of the euro equally so as I have a sister who lives in a country where the euro is currency.

Incidentally, when they converted to the euro they were totally fleeced as the new prices bore little relation to the correct exchange rate. There was a definite mark up on most things.

Frugalsod

nuatha wrote: »

I aim to keep 2.5 times the standard monthly outgoings, anything above that is withdrawn unless I'm planning a substantial purchase that fortnight. (I will top the account up to cover purchases that drop me below the planned margin, but can't be bothered to visit the bank more than fortnightly)
The logic is roughly this, as I'm self employed my income is variable and clients don't always (almost never) pay on time, therefore keeping two months outgoings means I have an additional month's safety margin to chase clients or correct the balance. I do keep some cash at home and in my vehicles, I also have a savings account with another bank.
Given the current available returns on money on deposit, I have no incentive to keep money in the bank, particularly as my suppliers give discounts for cash which is a far better return than I'd get from a bank.
I don't worry about bail in limits - I'm not likely to return to that income level - but any advice you get is a guess, remember Cypress started with the idea that a small percentage from every account was a good idea. At some point, a government will revisit that starting point, possibly with a sliding scale of "contribution" based on the amounts held.

Yes it does depend on your personal circumstances. Add in the lack of interest to make up for the risk of being an unsecured creditor in a bank it makes sense to limit your potential losses. If you have money in multiple banks or financial institutions you need to make sure that they are not all part of the same group, as they would be covered by the one depositor limit of £83000 (plus any accrued interest and some margin of error).

Though I am like you and do not worry about the bail in limits as I am nowhere near the deposit protection limit anyway. Though considering most people are also nowhere near the deposit protection limit either the government might have a lower limit to bail in, though too low and they would suffer at the next election. Though considering some banks leverage and risk profiles even every day depositors would be at risk of a total wipe out in a significant financial crisis.

If you have cut your monthly overheads down significantly it would also give you more leeway in terms of how many months you can cope with. Though if queues started appearing at banks again it might make sense to use some of that surplus cash to pay down mortgages and loans if outstanding. It might bring your funds at risk down significantly.

If you are at risk of losing your job then only keeping £6000 would also mean you are not at risk of losing benefits if needed.

GreyQueen

Morning all. It must be spring out there, not even daylight and the blackbirds on the carpark have been singing their little hearts out for hours. I do love the sound of blackbirds, they're so melodious. Particularly compared to the de-do, de-do call of the great tit, which I hear a lot of on the allotments.

almo, hello and nice to 'meet' you. As others have said, no two of us are going to have exactly the same circumstances vs incomings and outgoings. I presently have my bank account riding a bit higher than it normally would, but I will be paying my annual line rental later today, and it has been allowed to sit a bit high to accomodate that. After than transaction has cleared out, I'll be pulling cash for spends and saves.

I'd look at what you might want to do by running some scenarios.

1. Card is stolen, how much could a thief potentially take from the account? A trick is to lift a purse/ wallet and lift a card and return the purse/wallet. Idea is you don't immediately notice its loss. If your account had to be frozen due to your being a victim of crime, do you have (non-wallet) cash somewhere accessible to tide you over.

2. Card is lost/ defective and you need to wait for another one, and probably another PIN. How long would this take and what would you do in the meantime. If you need to fuel your car to get to your work and haven't any access to money, what would you do?

3. Do you always pay by card, and what would you do if the card-readers are down at the shop(s)? Have you a supply of cash?

4. If you are going to keep valuables at home (cash, gold jewelley, gold/ silver coins) have you several safe places to split them around? Your home contents insurance won't cover cash in any quantity and I doubt if it'd cover bullion at all.

I was enquiring of a jeweller pal last week the buying price for 'rolled gold' with is marked with RGold or RG and a 9ct or 14ct. Rolled gold is glorified plating over a base metal. It's worth 5p a gramme if you're selling now, and once refined, it's about 1.2% pure gold total per metal weight. But the jeweller suggested that as it's big and heavy and golden, you keep it conspiciously in a jewelley box to distract a burglar and hide any better stuff you have. Jewellers aren't particularly interested in RG because they have to pay to have it melted and assayed, and they typically need to save up about 5 kg to make it worthwhile doing.

5. If the bank fails, or temporarily closes to prevent a bank run, how will you manage your day-to-day expenditures? I have the telecoms, council tax and rent on direct debits, pay other bills by debit card transactions and take out cash which is for everything else. I like cash; it goes just about everywhere and keeps schtumm about what you're doing.

My entire wealth is humourously well below the advertised guarantee that the government covers, but I take that with a pinch or even a bucket of salt. Whether they could deliver that, to hundreds of thousands or even millions of bank customers, is something I doubt. And how fast they can deliver it; it's the government, it moves with glacial slowness in most cases.

moneyistooshorttomention

It's that £6,000 limit to savings that is the limit set down for unemployed people that is a large part of what I base my personal guesstimate figure of being allowed to keep £10,000 safe from theft on (aka Government bail-ins), as that makes it plain that even the poorest of people are deemed (by the Government) as capable of having £6k in savings and then they have to scale up to allow for what they think the average person will have. Reason being = the Government arent likely to want to be seen to hit a lot of "average people". The electoral consequences on them would be something they wouldnt want to face.

VJsmum

CRANKY40 wrote: »

I've been reading this thread the past couple of days and I've learnt a lot thank you. Not in terms of hands on survival, but about banks and monetary issues. The Greek crisis is worrying and talk of the collapse of the euro equally so as I have a sister who lives in a country where the euro is currency.

Incidentally, when they converted to the euro they were totally fleeced as the new prices bore little relation to the correct exchange rate. There was a definite mark up on most things.

I certainly saw that last bit for myself. The year before the Euro we took the family to France, the kids were really little then, and then we went back in Euro year. A silly example was that where a ride on a roundabout had been 10 francs (so £1 more or less), the following year it was 2 euros (about £1.60 then, if i recall right) - that was quite some increase.

I am reading along, but don't have much to add - love the interpretation of the greek issue and the stuff on gold. I recalled that i had a half sovereign my aunt had had set into a bracelet that she left me. Looked it up and it's worth around £120 :eek: I have a full sovereign somewhere that is much older.

Oh And Yanis Varoufakis is a dude!

GreyQueen

Yes, I was on Crete on holiday on 2 consecutive years, the last year of the drachma and the first year of the euro. I noted the admission prices of various historical sites for both years (and their sterling equivalents) in pencil in my guide book. The main archaeological site of Knossos was only about 20p dearer to enter in euro year uno but another Minoan palace site, but smaller, had doubled in price!

The local Greek people weren't overhappy with the price inflation either, and there are still people who remember what happened when we went to decimal currency here and are nursing a grudge about that.

VJsMum, depending on how your half-sovreign has been mounted as jewellery, it may have lost some of its value, I'm afraid. If the jewellery mount has been soldered on, or there are dents in the rim of the sovreign from being held by claws to the mount, it will be worth only scrappage price. Most mounted sovreigns have been damaged and devalued. Some mounts take the form of a gold rim wrapped around the edge of the coin, encasing it, and any mounts attached to that rim and not the coin itself, in which case it can be removed undamaged and a half-sov presently will fetch about £90, give or take (the gold price is moving hourly).

VJsmum

Amazingly both are mounted in a circle of gold (or something gold coloured) as I clearly remember "twizzling" them round and round in their cages. The half sov is coming out of the bracelet anyway because, as part of my Kondoing, I have decided that these things should be worn. without the sov (which isn't really me, auntie was more extrovert and blingy than me), it is a rather delicate bracelet. So i am going to get it altered, and i will ask for advice then.