HSBC refuse to refund debit card fraud

irrationalactor

pinkteapot wrote: »

Banks only refund if you haven't given anyone else access to your card and/or PIN and unfortunately you did.

Except he has stated that he was careful with his PIN number - it wasn't written down or anything silly like that. And E stole the card. I think the way the OP initially reacted to the theft is pretty admirable, especially after a drink or two.

The only consistent position is to press charges against both J and E and to complain in writing to HSBC. The OP in no way authorised this withdrawal and should expect the bank to a) believe him and b) be on his side in the investigation.

Normally I would be extremely reluctant to confront a criminal, but if you were friendly enough with J and E to have drinks and a pizza with them before this then perhaps you know how they would react to a confrontation. A demand for the money back might give you a better result?

I have no idea what trouble might result from that, however. Please be careful.

philD_2

Irrationalactor

Thanks for your comments. I no longer wish to associate with E or J as it is clear to me that they were not friends. With regards to getting the money back from E, J or a combination - not a chance.

I'm disappointed with HSBC as I spent along time on the phone with them explaining exactly what had happened and they simply wrote back (2nd class mail) and said that a 3rd party couldn't have made the transaction if my PIN hadn't been known.

Whilst trying to report the loss/theft of the card I also hit problems trying to contact them on their premium rate 0845 number and when I tried their reverse call number (listed on their site) I just got the message 'You have dialled an incorrect number'. If you try and send them a secure message via internet banking and select the subject 'lost/stolen' cards from the options, then you just receive a prompt asking you to contact them on their 0845 number and you can't send a message (although I understand this logic).

Also, looking at my statements I never use this specific ATM for large cash withdrawals - I use one near to my landlady's house - so fraudulent transaction for £470 is clearly unusual.

And another point I think they should consider: HSBC now have a security device to access internet banking - you type your PIN into this device and it provides a number to be used for internet banking. As my PIN had been compromised the bank sent a new PIN and card but they never advised me to change the PIN on my security device - I don't even know how to!

lovinituk

Phil, I'm sorry but for someone who works/used to work in IT, you don't come across as very bright! Press charges or just forget it.

philD wrote: »

And another point I think they should consider: HSBC now have a security device to access internet banking - you type your PIN into this device and it provides a number to be used for internet banking. As my PIN had been compromised the bank sent a new PIN and card but they never advised me to change the PIN on my security device - I don't even know how to!

The PIN is your card PIN.

philD_2

lovinituk

The HSBC security device requires a PIN to generate a key used for internet banking. I reckon that the most people would have used the same PIN for their security device as they had for their card (otherwise another number to remember). It would therefore be diligent for HSBC to advise customers (in circumstances where their PIN had been compromised) to change the PIN on their security device - in the interest of security!

lovinituk

It would also be diligent for you to report the theft of your money but hey-ho!

philD_2

lovinituk

If you bank with HSBC then you have a card for an ATM etc and also you have a security device which looks like a small calculator and is used to access internet banking.

The cards came first along with their associated PIN and then HSBC sent customers a security device (small calculator type thing) to be used for access to internet banking.

You clearly don't bank with HSBC.

The point is that many (if not most) people will have used their existing card PIN for their security device - therefore it would be diligent for HSBC to advise customers to change the PIN on their security device in circumstances where their card PIN had been compromised. All in the interest of security ...

lovinituk

You're still trying to blame everyone else except the actual thieves. Are you going to press charges or not? If not then we're done with this thread are we not?

Dr_Cuckoo3

philD wrote: »

And another point I think they should consider: HSBC now have a security device to access internet banking - you type your PIN into this device and it provides a number to be used for internet banking. As my PIN had been compromised the bank sent a new PIN and card but they never advised me to change the PIN on my security device - I don't even know how to!

this can be changed using internet banking and the digipass yellow button

philD wrote: »

The point is that many (if not most) people will have used their existing card PIN for their security device - therefore it would be diligent for HSBC to advise customers to change the PIN on their security device in circumstances where their card PIN had been compromised. All in the interest of security ...

there is a different number length for each

philD_2

No there isn't - 4 digits for the card PIN and 4 (or more) for the security device. I wouldn't have made the point if that were the case!

Dr_Cuckoo3

6 digits for the digipass