Lose Weight 35

gymsalesjames

Ok, so after some research I see it may be weightwatchers that do the awful ready meals, not slimming world, my bad. It's weightwatchers that are the true devils. Saying that though, I am looking through the slimming world diet page and am not impressed with what I see at all.

http://www.slimmingworld.com/healthy-eating/non-vegetarian-menu.aspx

Seems VERY heavy on the carbs and sugars and some of the meals are a disgrace

Day 2 for example:

Split a large baked potato (or two!) and spoon oodles of baked beans in tomato sauce over the top. Make up a delicious side of coleslaw by mixing shredded white cabbage, carrot, celery and slivers of red onion with fat free natural fromage frais and mustard powder. Enjoy fresh fruit for dessert, topped with a generous dollop of fat free natural yogurt.

That could be anywhere up to 1000cals nearly all in carbs! Then for dinner the same day:

Top a mound of cooked spaghetti with lashings of rich bolognese, made by frying an onion in low calorie cooking spray, adding extra lean mince, chopped tomatoes, tomato puree, chopped or grated carrot, celery, crushed garlic and dried oregano, seasoning with salt and black pepper and simmering for 10-15 minutes.

What's that? More carbs!! I'm seeing very little fats in this diet at all. I could fully deconstruct it and tear it apart but I dont have the time. It will not leave you feeling full at all, something I'll offer an explanation of at the end of this post.

Their first 2 "healthy" tips

Trim all visible fat off meat and remove all skin from poultry.
Cook your food in any way as long as no fat or oil is added.

I can only think of 1 comment that comes to mind...LOL.

Now then, why carbs make you hungry, some of this you may well already know but I'll go over it from the start for people that dont.

The goal of your body is to keep it's blood sugar levels stable, it does this mainly by regulating the release of 2 hormones, insulin and glucagon. It is insulin I will focus on as this is your main dieting enemy.

In it's simplest terms, insulin is the body's main storage hormone. It's released in varying amounts when you eat any foods.

Protein and fat have a small insulin response because they are slowly digested and release a steady stream of energy into your system.

Carbs on the other hand are generally assimilated by the body very easily and produce a large insulin response. The reason for this is that when you eat carbs they ae quickly converted to sugars and released into the bloodstream, elevating blood sugar levels quickly.

In response to this, your body releass a large amount of insulin to try and get blood sugar back down to normal. The problem arises because carbs spike blood sugar so high your body produces too much insulin in response and will lower blood sugar down to less than it should be. Hence you become hungry again, generally for more carbs as they are a quick fix to low blood sugar.

In the long term, if insulin levels are raised often your insulin receptors will become weaker, and you'll have to produce more and more insulin to get the same effect. This is called insulin resistance (or metabolic syndrome X) and leads to type 2 diabetes.

I am by no means saying eat NO carbs, I'm saying eat the right ones (low GI, avoid wheat) and make sure you're also eating plenty of protein and fats too. It's all about balance.

Lois_Lane

I'm fascinated with this topic because I've spent the last week trying to follow a plan based on the paleo diet mentioned on marksdailyapple.

This was part of a 14 day programme that also included intermittent fasting for 17 hours 2 days in succession, then a day with 3 low carb meals followed by a 22 hour fast. The plan also required 2 10-minute HIT workouts every day.

I've given up the programme after 6 days because to be frank, I was feeling very tired, weak even, I wasn't thinking straight and I had headaches all week.

Having read your posts James, I'm beginning to understand how this might work, but is fasting and high intensity training an essential part, or an add-on for extreme results in the short term?

LL

p.s. to clarify something about Slimming World, although pasta and rice are 'free' foods on green days, they are eaten with small amounts of meat. SW also do red days on which you can eat lots of meat and fish, but pasta and rice are limited. Bread is very limited on SW whatever plan you opt for. It's a complicated diet, but it does work. Whenever you read a story in the press about someone who has lost a lot of weight, it's usually SW they've been doing. There was a woman who lost 19 stone.

fredsnail

Regarding sitting at the table.

Grandad's care home usually have their tea while sitting in the lounge in their arm chairs. For the Jubilee they had a "street party" in the dining room due to the weather (they were due to have a barbeque).

The owner noticed that all the residents ate far more during the street party - so from now on they're having a street party everyday to get them to eat more. This is in their best interests because many of them don't have huge appetites and lose weight.

As for diets - different things work for different people. In the food industry image is everything - remember the orange drink (was it Sun Valley or something like that) that was sold from the fridge even though it didn't need to be refridgerated so it appeared to be healthy and fruit juice like. That soon lost it's image when people started to analyse it's contents.

Many people start a diet to lose some weight and then end their diet either through lack of will power, getting fed up of the restrictive nature of their diet, or by losing the required weight. The trouble is to keep the weight off it needs to be a lifestyle change because if you go back to the old ways you end up where you were before you dieted - many times even worse.

Many people are like sheep - they follow the herd because they're told it's the right thing, they don't investigate things for themselves because it's too confusing, too time consuming and sometimes means you have to make decisions for yourselves. The press, government and health professionals are to blame for this. Many people believe it's really easy to lose weight - eat less, exercise more and voila instant weight loss.

Well I am proof that this is not always the case. Over the last 10 years I've eaten less and exercised more and put weight on steadily despite everything. I'm sure that I've damaged my metabolism as a result of not eating enough so I've done my research and am doing a metabolism reset - basically eating my TDEE calories which is the calories I would need to maintain my weight given my current exercise levels - for the past 4 weeks I've eaten more than double the number of calories than previously, I've put on 3lbs which I expected (it was 4 but I lose 1lb this week), but I've far more energy, feel happier, my skin is better, I'm less tired and I've started to lose inches. I've another 4 weeks of this then I do a 15% cut where I will lose weight and have to have regular full TDEE weeks to avoid a plateau.

Some in the history of this thread have found the way to success and shared it - Eric, World_of_Tights and All I want come to mind. All did it over a long period of time and worked hard and stuck to it and are an inspiration. Many on here have difficulties that mean it's hard for them to lose weight - they do their best and are also inspirational - Beanie is one such person. No one on here judges anyone and everyone tries their best despite things going on in their life. Nothing ever came to those who didn't put effort and commitment into it.

There maybe underhand tactics going on - but ultimately people need to look at what they're eating and educate themselves that the quickest things are not always best for them. Cookery lessons in schools for both boys and girls would be a good start.

margaretclare

Fascinating discussion.

On the positive side for SW - my stepdaughter has recently lost 9 stone with them. She lost the same amount of weight that her sister-in-law actually weighs! I think, with her, it was finding a new group of friends, like-minded people, which has been of enormous help to her in a difficult period of her life - 3rd marriage break-up when husband walked out, 'back-stabbing' and office politics in her high-powered job. Those SW friends are completely separate from other people that had been in her life up to then.

She tried to explain the SW methods to me and I couldn't get my head around it.

WW, on the other hand, I regard as rubbish. Can't get my head around their 'points' system either and.....well, just read the list of ingredients on any of their products. I go by a very simple maxim about ingredients - if you either can't pronounce it or don't know what it does, then don't buy it.

About bread - I much prefer bread baked according to traditional methods, fresh, local, rather than mass-produced and transported hundreds of miles. The obvious corollary of this is that it has extra ingredients added for 'shelf life'. The bread we get from our local baker has no shelf-life - it's made fresh a few hours before it flies off the shelves.

Having said that, I have noticed that the days when I've eaten more bread than usual - the days we went out for a picnic, for instance - my weight has started to go back up, whereas if I ate little or no bread it came down. That being the case, this morning we've had half a grapefruit with Splenda for sweetening and 2 eggs scrambled and cooked in butter, with a little creme fraiche added. It was lovely. I ate a small piece of the crust off the loaf and will not have any more bread in the day.

Yesterday I read up about olive oil vs rapeseed oil - we intend to junk the rapeseed oil in favour of extra-virgin olive oil. We don't use a huge amount of it anyway.

Reducing the amount of carbs we eat, from last July has certainly been of benefit to both DH and me. I've lost approx 3 kg since then and DH's weight has been gradually coming down. He now uses about half the insulin he was using before. We no longer eat any potatoes at all.

Fredsnail, the older people in the care home will have grown up used to the idea of eating at a table rather than sitting in armchairs. It was common for a 'best room' to be kept with armchairs and you didn't eat there - the crumbs and the mess!! Eating in an armchair has only become common practice since TV - people don't want to miss their favourite TV programme and that is where that idea comes from. Food manufacturers capitalise on that by putting a lot of ads in the breaks so, you're sitting there, you get a reminder to 'eat something'!

margaretclare

Just back from aqua-aerobics, I go there 3 x a week 45 mins.

Further about SW, as quoted above I wouldn't like it. 'Lashings of, oodles of, mounds of....' it was a bit like the Practice Nurse said to me 'oh you can eat as much as you like of (pasta, potatoes, rice, etc) Given that the amount that is 'as much as I like' is probably not that much, but, having grown up in a time of rationing. I don't warm to terminology like 'oodles of, mounds of...' Just a mindset which would be hardest to change.

I intend to go back to doing an oatbran pancake at tea-time as per Dukan. Oatbran, egg, a spoonful of fromage frais.

I agree with you, Fred. The received wisdom about weight loss as you've quoted can be demonstrated by many of us not to work!!

gymsalesjames

Lois_Lane wrote: »

I'm fascinated with this topic because I've spent the last week trying to follow a plan based on the paleo diet mentioned on marksdailyapple.

This was part of a 14 day programme that also included intermittent fasting for 17 hours 2 days in succession, then a day with 3 low carb meals followed by a 22 hour fast. The plan also required 2 10-minute HIT workouts every day.

I've given up the programme after 6 days because to be frank, I was feeling very tired, weak even, I wasn't thinking straight and I had headaches all week.

Having read your posts James, I'm beginning to understand how this might work, but is fasting and high intensity training an essential part, or an add-on for extreme results in the short term?

LL

p.s. to clarify something about Slimming World, although pasta and rice are 'free' foods on green days, they are eaten with small amounts of meat. SW also do red days on which you can eat lots of meat and fish, but pasta and rice are limited. Bread is very limited on SW whatever plan you opt for. It's a complicated diet, but it does work. Whenever you read a story in the press about someone who has lost a lot of weight, it's usually SW they've been doing. There was a woman who lost 19 stone.

Tried to highlight problems I have with what you wrote. Dieting is not about quick fix plans (14day plan you mentioned). It is about changing your lifestyle. If after the 14 days you go back to what you were doing before, you'll just gain the weight back.

Secondly, 2 sessions of cardio a day is extremely excessive. 3-4 sessions a week of HIIT is ample exercise.

I'm not surprised you felt awful trying that diet, intermittant fasting (IF) and HIIT is not a good combo, unless you break the fast straight after the cardio. The IF and cardio are certainly optional in that plan you want extreme (unmaintainable) weightloss.

IF is a decent way to go about dieting but it is very impractical in the long term, especially if you have work/kids etc. If you stick to paleo principles you can't really go wrong.

Margaret: "I go by a very simple maxim about ingredients - if you either can't pronounce it or don't know what it does, then don't buy it. "

This is a very good mantra to go by.

Fred: Have you had your thyroid hormone levels checked? If you're eating less and exercising more that's the only reason I can think of that you wouldn't lose weight.

A lot of people dont realise how much they are actually eating. Have you seen "secret eaters"? It has been on TV recently and highlighted how much people underestimate their calorie intake by!!

Lois_Lane

Hi all :wave:

Well, the extreme plan had one good effect - I lost 6lbs!

James - thanks for your comments. I'm sure the 14 day plan I was following is aimed at getting dramatic results in order to convince people it's the right thing to do, and it may be ok for people who are already fit and only have a little excess body fat but certainly not for a middle aged, obese, arthritic person that struggles to do many exercises!

Margaretclare - I'm doing weightwatchers and I've had some success - total weight loss is now 2 stone 3lbs - but I don't buy their products. I cook from scratch - no ready meals - and eat ordinary, traditional food. I find the point system quite logical, and it just helps to raise my awareness of my intake. I plan my meals so that if lunch is high in points, dinner will be low, and vice versa.

Fred - I find it difficult to eat a meal if I'm not sat at the table, it just doesn't feel right. As a child my family all sat round the table together to eat meals and DH and I did the same with our children. My daughter is now continuing the tradition with our granddaughter, so it's definitely habitforming.

Today wasn't a great day diet-wise - we went to visit friends who provided us with lunch, which was fish and chips, followed by a cream cake. We had lunch late, I haven't eaten anything since and I'm not hungry, so I'm hoping it will last until breakfast.

Good luck everyone with your weigh-ins.

LL

beanielou

1/2 lb off for me.
Disappointed but hey ho.

lolly101

Hey Everyone,

Loving the chat recently, I wanted to reply to a lot of you but haven't felt up to it. I've been feeling really tired and have had lots of aches and pains lately, I've also had a banging headache behind my left eye everyday since last mon - which is not nice at all! Prob nothing but will get it checked out tomorrow.

Not weighed in for over a week now as the batteries have gone on my scales. Starting to feel quite uncomfortable about it as I like to 'check in' daily to keep on top of it, so will try and get some more soon.

Hoping to join in again soon...

margaretclare

Well, we have taken on board the suggestions here and on the links i.e. animal fat is NOT the baddie we have been led to believe! We always bought butter but haven't used it in cooking. Yesterday for tea-time I went back to making my little oatbran pancake as recommended by Dr Dukan - oatbran, an egg and a spoonful of fromage frais - but I cooked it in butter as recommended by DH. I've never been used to cooking in butter - he grew up with it. Whereas I would have cooked in lard, obviously lard was a no-no in a Jewish household. It came out well and I put a spoonful of Yeo Valley fruit compote on it. Very nice. So the only bread I ate yesterday was half a slice of GI bread with a bit of Tiptree marmalade. This morning, well-grilled bacon and tomato - and I did eat all the fat - and half a slice of bread like yesterday. We're going to have a ham salad at lunch-time.

Having been 'brainwashed' for so long about 'animal fat is bad' it does feel strange, but hey, we'll give it a go.

This morning, 67.7 kg